Housing Minister Terry Le Main
RICH City workers fleeing the UK to avoid rising tax rates will be welcomed into Jersey, according to the politician who approves residency applications from wealthy immigrants.
Housing Minister Terry Le Main sees a ‘huge benefit’ to the Island if British financiers, angered by Labour’s new 50% tax rate and one-off 50% levy on all banker bonuses over £25,000, move across the Channel.
He said that there had been ‘quite a lot of interest’ from wealthy residents looking to move to Jersey.
‘I am very keen,’ he said. ‘I see huge benefits in welcoming wealthy residents who are relocating, particularly if they bring in business opportunities. I will be very much supportive of a good business case where there hopefully could be some diversification in the economy. I would also be welcoming a good business case which will employ locally qualified people.’
Article posted on 16th December, 2009 - 3.00pm
51 Article Comments
le main has failed to tell us that they are already here. Check the times online web site, it even names them.
Yet more people in Jersey increasing house prices. Bringing thier dependents with them. More cars on our roads. We don’t need more bankers.
All because the UK goverment can’t say NO TO BONUSES.
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Q. When is a haven for tax evaders not a ‘tax haven’?
A. When the evaders are white, British, and suddenly very, very rich.
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I welcome wealthy residents who will negotiate the percentage of tax they pay, meanwhile we will continue to screw the locals !!!
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It must be hard for Jersey people to stomach, Politicians welcoming tax evaders and giving them preferential treatment over local people and bragging about it in the media. Le main etc, you are a disgrace and wouldn’t last two minutes in a normal country’s government!
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Sure come on in, move straight into a luxury apartment ( no quallies for you ) pay an accountant to dodge tax and live like a lord. Hell you might even employ some of us as footservants.
Good old Tezza whoring the island for all he’s worth, meantime tax the common man to extinction.
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Karen (2.), what has race got to do with it? Really random. Anyway yes these new residents will pay less tax as a percentage but the amount of money they’ll contribute to the Jersey economy in local spend including GST is a good thing.
Any speak of morals or ethics is completely irrelevant living on an island where offshore finance is the main income earner. The majority of islanders work in this sector advising or administering tax avoidance everyday for international business people whether living in Jersey or abroad.
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From the times online, Hundreds of bosses flee UK over 50% tax… worth reading.
The number of directors of British businesses registered as living in the low-tax centres of Jersey, Guernsey or the Isle of Man has risen by almost 500 to 6,729 in the past 12 months.
Jersey Finance, an agency set up to attract financial talent to the island, has held a series of private dinners in London to woo new residents. TAUFUAS!!
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i am not often moved to comment (decades of stupidity from our elected ‘elite’ have blunted my senses) but Mr. Le Main’s comments are at best crass and at worst unhelpful. in an era where global powers appear to be finally co-ordinating their efforts to clamp down on tax havens, this kind of bluster can only draw unwanted attention to us.
not to mention the morality/public outrage on the issue – the british are understandably outraged by the sheer blind greed exhibited by these bankers – they have helped bring the global economy to the brink of an abyss, and now want to be paid astronomical sums for such a catastrophic performance.
to offer these parasites and brigands succour in our land is disgusting and does us no favours – they are self-evidently only interested in securing the most favourable taxation terms for themselves, and will simply up sticks if they don’t get what they want.
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As a small island with a completely incapable Government it’s worth nothing that money isn’t everything and sometimes it is beneficial to maintain good relationships with other (larger) countries!
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“‘I see huge benefits in welcoming wealthy residents”
Of course he does. More idiots to hob nob with, go for posh dinners, and probably secured votes also! But, he’s just one man, what about Jersey?
And, who on earth is going to welcome bankers? Have they had their eyes and ears shut for the last few years? The bankers have proven themselves to be incompetent, even some bankers have admitted that they were at fault!
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I cant get my head around why so many islanders are against wealthy people coming to the island?? Do people have economical/social apprehensions etc or is it just jealousy?
I wonder what I would rather?
A millionaire come live in Jersey, who on a Friday night might have a nice walk with the family around the harbour, pump a bit of money into the economy by having a nice meal at one of our lovely restaurants, possibly drink a bottle of wine, give Home James a ring and retire to their “mansion” in the country all without bothering people.
Or,
Keep filling St Helier with benefit grabbing, head stomping thugs from outside the island that settle and produce growing generations of troubled angry children that act as social pests for all of us?
Why do islanders love bashing bankers and the rich so much??
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Sir
We are indeed fortunate that Senator Le Main displays rather more wisdom and compassion than many of the correspondents here.
As a Christian it fills me with joy that, on behalf of our community, he has extended the hand of friendship to those who are facing persecution and oppression by a mainland government which is seeking scapegoats in order to hide its own incompetence and economic mismanagement.
After all, over the years Jersey has benefitted enormously from their endeavours and it is only fit and proper that we should now offer them sanctuary at their time of greatest need.
Those who would wish to turn their backs on these people – at Christmas of all times – should hang their heads in shame.
Proud Jerseyman
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Hear! Hear! ‘Sam L’ (correspondent 11). I concur wholeheartedly with your sentiments.
Moreover, the presence of wealthy individuals could serve as an example and a spur to those from less privileged backgrounds to better themselves.
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#Sam L – well said….
on your last remark “Why do islanders love bashing bankers and the rich so much?? ”
The bankers deserve to be bashed. (Please do not try this at home!) It was these idiots who caused the golbal crisis in the first place.
…but i do agree with the rest of your post.
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These sort of comments from our ‘illustrious’ leaders really shouldn’t be any surprise. This one in particular certainly will leave HM Revenue in no doubt how the Island stands on Tax Havens and dodging. Nice one Tel.
I have no problem in 1(1)K status residents, however there should be a level playing field. Our CM has stated that many of the mega rich are paying less Tax than is desirable, but it would be unfair to re-negotiate their position. Er hello ! ? My ITIS rate goes up and down like the proverbial, so why should someone who is in a far better position to pay a little more get away with it, while the common man is wrung dry?
The States are cash short, due mainly to the Leviathan which they are. Why not ‘assess’ the 1(1)K residents annually, publish their net worth and the agreed Taxation payable there on. I’m sure there will not be a mass exodus. The few people I know in this bracket actually like living here in Jersey and a few more quid out in Tax wont really affect them or cause them to pack their suitcases.
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The bank of England has just published a report saying if the relevant financial institutions had just paid out 20% less bonuses in the half dozen years before the implosion, then they would have bolstered their capital reserves enough to avoid the crisis and the bailout would have been unnecessary. Instead the people who have left the average UK family £40k in hoc are welcomed over here with open arms so they can avoid sharing the pain having contributed disproportionately to the mess and trousered the illusory profits of many of the financial instruments they peddled.
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Remember contentment is not in wealth, but wealth is in contentment…..Socrates ca 500 BC. I’d rather be happy than rich.
As long as these ‘in comers’ pay their taxes in an equitable manner and contribute to the Island’s economy, why shouldn’t the bonus earning bankers be allowed in ? (Am I saying this tongue in cheek to spark debate?).
Maybe Jersey’s new industry could be being a dormitory for Bankers…..I said ‘Bankers’. Those people who lend money to people who can’t pay it back and mess up the economy becaue they didn’t do their home work.
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Typical car dealer quick buck mentality….sooner you are gone the better.
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The problem with the type of wealthy immigrants Mr. Le Main is Adcocating needs to be properly scrutinised i.e are they declaring all overseas incomes, are they super rich drugs dealers, are they wealthy smugglers, does the income actually come from illegal sources? how would anyone know? The Island is in a recession just like any where else in the world, yes extra jobs and revenue is a desirable assett to attract but at what price to the dignaty of islanders?
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Valid points David but do those over here give a damn? Apparently not as long as they keep getting paid. Not only have some of these people left nealry every person in the UK in a worse state they also now have the cheek to want to take their taxes away from the UK treasury as well. Reduced taxes means the rest have to make up the shortfall via extra taxation for schooling and hospitals as well.
Sam do you really think more people paying maybe 5% tax over here is what the island wants? I would prefer encouraging 20% people myself.
Think about it. Tax havens a getting a big bashing at the moment. It is not a good time to be drawing peoples attention to that fact that the rich can save on taxes by coming here. What will others, not just in the UK, but around the world think of all this? Will they think oh it doesn’t matter or will they be upset about it?
There is a moral and ethical issue over taxation or the lack of. This is why it isn’t the best business to put all your eggs in to.
Indeed these sorts may spend a few pounds in the local economy (a lot less than if they were paying 20% I’m sure) however what about the impact on the island?
Too many rich people in one area tend to push up house prices due to their ability to write a blank cheque for the right house. Supply and demand means that house prices will rise with extra people coming into the island especially if they have lots of money. Their offspring will probably perpetuate the cycle as well when they are old enough.
This might be good for developers, but what about the rest of the island population who see house prices rocketing into the stratosphere? Indeed you will probably find many of these people will want to get into property over here as another way of avoiding paying tax. As Jersey has no CGT, profit from property is tax free, another bonus for those with lots of money.
mistershifter I agree why should we have to pay more tax when others can walk in and pay less in real terms? What benefit is this to the rest of us?
Mark people tend to bash those they see as not contributing what they should or because they have got us in this mess. If the two are one and the same is it any wonder the others are annoyed with them?
People world wide are suffering because of this financial meltdown. Why shouldn’t those who cause it be expected to tidy up after themselves instead of getting bonuses and moving offshore to avoid paying their taxes?
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The ordinary people of this island are sick of this,what does it say to the rest of the world ? we are just a cheap tart for hire,the reason the bonuses have been taxed at 50% is to restrain the unbridled gambling with peoples livelihoods in the first place,the public had to bail out these chancers in banks.who clearly have not learned the lessons and promptly recommenced the bonus culture.to the embarrassment and shame of everyone else,Banking has a false image,one of being respectable and honorable,and all in the correct suits,Iceland was bought down by their gambling,Britain suffered a massive body blow as well,Banking lest we forget should simply be a channeling of money from savers to borrowers in a cost effective way that also shows them a profit, their complex financial products are touted as beneficial and cost effective to the user,but have simply been instruments of fleecing the punters….how are they in anyway better or less contemptable than the moneylenders whose tables were scattered in the Temple…and one of our representatives is eager to offer escape from paying their dues to them,brings us to a new low in morals ,integrity and avarice,no wonder people are revileing our whoring. Terry, stand down we don’t want to live like you.
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#11 “A millionaire … might have a nice walk with the family around the harbour,… a nice meal at one of our lovely restaurants, possibly drink a bottle of wine,… and retire to their “mansion”… all without bothering people.”
I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that rich folk are automatically quiet, law-abiding citizens, or old for that matter. One of the biggest threats to women’s safety in London is considered to be the ‘City boys’. The ‘City’ (according to City people) breeds a ‘we can do anything we want’ attitude that, along with the inbred misogyny, is greatly increasing the number of sexual assaults on women in London. Of course, these boys can afford the best lawyers and have ‘friends’ that think the women must have wanted it and so stick up for them! How could any women NOT want these guys!!!!!
Wouldn’t it just be great to have more of those people over here? I really don’t think so.
Love of money, which many (but thankfully not all) rich people do have, brings with it a real streak of nastiness and a (false) sense of superiority.
Jersey could really do with more people that are law-abiding and actually care about the island, whether rich or not so rich.
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#16 David, unfortunately some of these people are sooooo up themselves they just cannot see that they are to blame. They really can’t. And it beggars belief because there isn’t an intelligent person out there who, when pushed, won’t admit that these guys were to blame.
But to seriously paraphrase Will Hutton, maybe we are seeing the horrible potential of a ‘free market’ when left in the hands of the greedy and amoral! As with most things they can be either good or bad, the free market could have continued to be a good thing but it was in the wrong hands.
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Truthseekers post should be published on the front page of the JEP and anybody who disagrees with it sent to Dubai.
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No13 “Moreover, the presence of wealthy individuals could serve as an example and a spur to those from less privileged backgrounds to better themselves. ”
I guess your idea of “better” must be very different to mine. “Better” to me means doing your job to the best of your ability, whatever job that is. It also means having morals and valuing people over money!
It is very possible to be the absolute top of your field and earn nowhere near what those incompetent bankers who brought about the world’s financial collapse were earning. The scientists continually progressing our ability to treat cancer earn a lot less!
If you consider those bankers “better” than those from less privileged backgrounds then I really do pity you because those bankers have failed at their job and proven their incompetence. Where were you when this was going on? They FAILED! How can that ever be “better” than anyone? Some people from less privileged backgrounds are excelling in their “lesser” jobs while maintaining a proper perspective on what is important in life. That is what should be applauded not some private school, silver spooned, daddy’s connections got me my job scenario. Doing your job and doing it brilliantly is a real sign of success not monetary gain, and the bankers got the latter but failed spectacularly in the former.
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The banker-bashing is very trendy, but intellectually simplistic. The vast majority of people in banking had nothing to do with the decision-making at the top, so why all your hateful bile? Do those on minimum wages at local call-centre deserve your contempt and wishes that they lose their jobs? And please don’t forget, the taxes from these hard-working people go a long way to paying for the world class health, education etc we have here. Not that any of this will convince the moaners on this forum…
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If it weren’t for us taxpayer’s money, most of these big banks would no longer exist – they took our money and lied, the solution is to topple Capitalism – Anarchy forever!
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“If it weren’t for us taxpayer’s money, most of these big banks would no longer exist..”
Au contraire. If it hadn’t been for Bush and Brown encouraging and in some circumstances insisting that banks lend to people who had no way of paying off the loans the banks would never have got into trouble.
Bush and brown both artificially created an asset bubble because they reckoned as long as people felt wealthy they would vote encumbent poltiicians back in. And feeling wealthy meant having a house going up in value.
They are the culprits here. But then, the greatest trick the devil ever pulled was making people doubt his existence.
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Adrian 20,
Exactly how does a 1(1)k in the market for property >£1.5m affect house prices for those looking to get on the ladder at say £400k? That’s like saying demand for Ferraris increases the cost of a Fiat 500.
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#28 It won’t take you much web searching to find people who those banks actually stole from. I was one such person. Now, they only stole around £140 from me but assuming I’m not the only person (and as it turns out I’m not) then they could have been making an absolute mint! And no, I’m not one of those who was being overcharged for being overdrawn, I’d CLOSED my account in writing 6 times and they failed to close it and made me overdrawn, then charged!
#26 “The vast majority of people in banking had nothing to do with the decision-making at the top” Very true, I think it’s safe (at this stage in the game) to assume that those who were extremely involved in it are the targets for the bile. And yes, THEY were to blame. Calling it intellectually simplistic doesn’t stop it being so. Plenty of brilliant minds will happily state that those bankers were to blame.
Also, it was ruled illegal the charges that banks were applying, intentionally forcing people into a hole they could never get out of. The fact that the situation has temporarily stalled is simply because for more money to go into the banks to pay back the millions they took it from WE will be the ones to pay!
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#28 To be honest, greed is to blame. Not the greed of two men, they are simply not that powerful when compared to a collective of extremely wealthy individuals. It took the greed of many men to bring down the economy. But then the system was flawed from the days of Thatcher and it just finally came to bit us in the proverbial.
Materialism just isn’t the way to live. Thankfully some have learned the lesson but alas, some will never learn it.
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Leah – I’ve learnt that when it comes to posts by Proud Jerseyman, the best way of reading them is to read between the lines. They are, actually – and, I suspect, very deliberatly – quite hilarious…. Some of what he’s written in this comments’ section is very obviously meant to, ahem, take the Michael out of certain people…
Sorry ‘PJ’, your secret’s out, LOL… But good on ya for making me chuckle.
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“It won’t take you much web searching to find people who those banks actually stole from. I was one such person.”
Leah,
without wishing to suggest you have got the wrong end of the stick, the problem with the banks is – fundamentally – that they lent money to large numbers of people (mainly poor, black and American) who could not repay it. Those mortgages were then repackaged, mis-rated and resold to other banks who thought they were buying safe assets.
Most big, European banks did not think they were doing anything risky. They were buying assets that were linked to US mortgages, that carried insurance and that had been rated as very secure by rating agencies. It just so happens the rating agencies had been asleep and the insurance turned out to be worthless. But the idea that it was greed what made the crisis is a simplistic and convenient untruth.
but to return to your case, iff the cause of the crisis had been banks stealing from people, you would have expected the banks to be sitting on a pile of (stolen) money, not worthless debt.
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There seems to be a very fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of tax evasion in some of the posts above. Moving to Jersey to take advantage of a tax regime that is more lenient than the UK is not tax evasion. It is simply paying your taxes in the place where you live. Just as a UK resident pays UK tax and a French resident pays French tax, so a Jersey resident pays Jersey tax. Tax evasion occurs where a person remains resident in the UK (for example), but hides income or assets offshore and does not declare them to the UK taxman. This is simply not what we are talking about here. Tel boy is absoluately correct, wealthly immigrants are precicely what this island needs right now, they boost the economy for the benefit of everyone.
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joker do you think the prices of property over here would be as high if there were no 1.1k’s, or any very rich people?
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34 Peter…wrong….bonuses should be based on merit, banking and tax evasion/avoidance…whetever you call it amounts to NOT Paying. is not honorable. all other buisnessses are penalised for failure,bankers take the public’s money given by the Govt,and still award themselves these ridiculously immoral gifts…it is greed and theft plain and simple and I for one do Not want these racketeers here,and their own Govt deserves their tax revenue.have you no moral fibre.
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To all those who speak of boosting our economy what good does it do? Over inflate house prices, whilst wages stay the same..see us pay double what people in the uk pay for food clothing etc.. and prevent any hard working LAW ABIDING HONEST person actually having any chance of making in their own island.. if any one has the cheek to say it will provide jobs etc etc get your facts straight.. lets see how many immigrants and expats over locals actually get the newly created jobs.. in finance and otherwise.. and no it is not because locals are not all thick a lot have common sense and will not be bullied into breaking laws and policies to suit fat cats..
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Sir,
As a proud Jerseyman it galls me that an equally “Proud Jerseyman” should stoop to declaring that:
“As a Christian it fills [him] with joy that, on behalf of our community, [Senator Le Main] has extended the hand of friendship to those who are facing persecution and oppression by a mainland government which is seeking scapegoats in order to hide its own incompetence and economic mismanagement”.
As a self-proclaimed Christian, my proud compatriot might care to meditate on Matthew 21:12 or – if he prefers – to cast his pious eyes over Mark 11:15.
Both verses tell the story of Jesus casting out the money changers.
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@ Adrian #20
“…Sam do you really think more people paying maybe 5% tax over here is what the island wants? I would prefer encouraging 20% people myself…”
Just to be clear; it’s only the middle to high incomes you want to see taxed at 20%, you’re happy to see low incomes taxed at less then 20%, often much, much less?
I think 20% is about right for the average income, and I think that lower taxation for low incomes is ‘fair’ too; but there has to come a point when taxation of very high incomes by a strict % is just not fair.
10% income tax on an income of £10m is £1m, does this person get anywhere near £1m of public services?
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“I’m not sure where you’re getting the idea that rich folk are automatically quiet, law-abiding citizens, or old for that matter. One of the biggest threats to women’s safety in London is considered to be the ‘City boys’. The ‘City’ (according to City people) breeds a ‘we can do anything we want’ attitude that, along with the inbred misogyny, is greatly increasing the number of sexual assaults on women in London. Of course, these boys can afford the best lawyers and have ‘friends’ that think the women must have wanted it and so stick up for them! How could any women NOT want these guys!!!!!”
Leah, although I was born in Jersey, will always call it home and look forward to returning one day, I work about 300ft from the BoE and have no idea what you comment above is supposed to mean? According to me, the city breeds nothing more than hard workers who dislike paying bills and taxes as much as the rest of society. We groan at the sound of our alarm clocks and dream of days that don’t involve the pain that is commuting. Simply put, Gordon Gekko is a fictional character, don’t let your imagination outstrip the limited amount of sense that you apparently have.
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#33, indeed, I wasn’t suggesting their theft was the cause of the debt, just that they get away with murder in the way they treat people. It has become quite scary what banks are getting away with. Most of it due to employing their own debt collection agents but making out like they are a separate company, then employing their own lawyers but again making out like they are a separate company. It can take quite a bit of searching to find out their sitting in the same office as the your bank’s customer service agent! If it wasn’t morally questionably they wouldn’t be trying so hard to hide what they are doing. Banks have just got too big for their boots.
Short-selling (the ‘greed’ element) and the bonus culture (also ‘greed’) have also been blamed for the crisis, not just lending to those that couldn’t pay it back, although that is undoubtedly part of it. Note, I have absolutely no issue with your bog-standard bank worker, most could have done no more to aid the situation than I could.
As for mortgage lending, when I bought my house it was cheaper to buy than to rent. I was lucky in that I could also afford it. If people couldn’t afford to buy they would have been homeless or crashing with friends/family, which is not that easy if you are a couple or have kids. That’s not the banks’ fault but it is a major issue within society. Some of those people had mortgages because it was that or living on the streets. The ‘Haves’ have been very quick to sling mud saying that people shouldn’t have got a mortgage if they couldn’t afford it, presumably those are people with family to fall back on if they ever lose their own roof.
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Whats next a cap on earnings? From all of your rants above it seems this is what you are ultimately arguing for. Now fit that in to a capitalist society and er oh, it doesnt work.
I say free market, the same free market that has excelled Britian into one of the richest (comparatively speaking) countries in the world.
Cut bankers wages, cut the ecomony and the free market. Jersey folk you need to think before you speak – did you not learn this at school?
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It’s hard to read through so many SAME SAME comments and remember which ones are worth mentioning by the time you get to the end!
Special ‘nod of agreement’ to #11,#12,#13 & #14
it seems that you grasp both micro and macro economies and are willing to accept it regardless of your own situations.
Everyone on the other side of the fence, try to appreciate where the money for this island comes from and why the standard of living is so good, because of many high earners! We have a very privalidged lifestyle here, something that I hear from jelous visitors on a daily basis.
I suggest that it should go to the vote EXCEPT instead of voting if we should invite the displaced bankers here we vote if we should allow all the people who don’t appreciate just how lucky we are to stay!
I do agree that Mr Le Mains statement does seem cras in the light of the crackdown on offshore finance however it needed to be said in some way.
It is very unfortunate that people cannot grasp how fundamentally important finance is to our existance although possibly worse are those who tar the entire financial world with one brush. Many financial institutions were and are very risk adverse and had nothing to do with the economic collapse yet all that is seen by people are ‘bankers’.
I hate to hear this said but on occasion it needs to be, if people do not like what happens here GO ELSEWHERE! Do not worry we would find many other people more than happy to take you place in society.
It really narks me to hear people bashing the island and the good people who work here, I choose this island for me and my family and if you can suggest somewhere better with low crime, clean streets, safe beaches, good schools… oh and where I don’t need to commute for an hour or more each day to work in town, please let me know where this is! Also by the rules you clearly have in mind, most housing should be next to free, tax nearly non existant and the government so sickly sweet and good they literally walk down the street giving away their own possesions for the good of the community!
Sorry, where is this place again?
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Tony Gallichan (Correspondent 32)
I am afraid to say that you are mistaken. Perhaps it is not surprising that you misinterpret my intentions when it is somewhat unfashionable to declare one’s adherence to what is known as ‘The Jersey Way’ as well as one’s admiration of, and gratitude towards, such distinguished figures as Mr Walker and Senator Le Main.
‘God Fearer’ (Correspondent 38)
I would suggest that your’s is a somewhat liberal/Marxist interpretation of the Good Book.
Indeed, if you were to ‘kick over the tables’ at any of the local financial institutions tomorrow it would probably only result in your incarceration over the Christmas period.
Instead I would invite you to meditate upon the Parable of the Talents.
‘For everyone who has will be given more, and he will have abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him’.
(Matthew 25:29)
Therefore in their constant pursuit of on the financial markets these bankers were surely only following scriptural teaching – as was Senator Le Main in his endeavours to ensure that they retained a greater share of their hard earned wealth. (Matthew 13:12; Mark 4:25;
Luke 8:18; Luke 19:26).
Nevertheless, may I take this opportunity to wish you both (as well as all other corresponspondents and the moderators) ‘Compliments of the Holy Season’.
Proud Jerseyman
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Lamborrari the same percentage income tax is generally seen as the fairest way to go. Why should someone struggling to get by pay 20% tax on their meagre income when a multi-millionaire doesn’t? This is plain wrong as far as I am concerned.
If I earnt £10M I would be happy to pay the same as everyone else pays. This is what tax is all about paying your fair share. Just because you earn lots shouldn’t mean you get a discount. If everyone adopted this approach no one would pay anything.
If someone who earns £10m can’t manage on £8M odd then there is something seriously wrong.
As far as I am concerned you either:-
1.tax everyone 20p in the pound regardless of income, which could be set at a lower percentage, if everyone paid.
However what about looking after those unable to do so themselves? Do you let them go without and starve?
I couldn’t do this so welfare would have to be paid and an agreed threshold would have to be set below which extra payments were made.
2.You draw a line in the sand at say £20,000 per person, any one above this regardless of income above this amount pays 20% on income above £20,000.
You still have the issue of those unable to fend for themselves. Even Neaderthals had the compassion to do this for their fellow man if they were unable to “work”. However maybe this isn’t so for modern man now?
Also if everyone who earns a decent wage leaves a country for a tax haven etc then who is there left to shoulder the burden back home? The same usual suspects i.e. those just above poverty and up a bit. This is totally unfair and shows a lack of community spirit as far as I am concerned.
There is more to life than looking after oneself first, second, third… and last.
Lucky Bean sorry have to disagree I’m afraid. Just because people have lots of money doesn’t mean they will spend it in Jersey. If they wouldn’t spend it on tax back home what makes you think they will spend it over here?
At the end of the day the world is getting ruined by greed and consumerism. Anyone who says it isn’t has no understanding of eco-systems and the environment.
Money is an illusion that people will fight and die for. It is only mankind that believes in this daft system, nothing else depends on this illusion besides human beings.
Money has the appearance of worth but is all but worthless. It is all down to confidence and nothing else. If it weren’t then money would never alter in value would it? If you are still unsure then maybe read up on the Weimar Republic to see what happens when confidence is lost in a currency.
What happens when the world economy collapses due to a ruined planet? What then? Will ten pound notes feed you when there is no food? Will they clothe you when there are no shops….
I say wake up before it is too late.
Others have also asked me why shouldn’t these people pay the islanders lots of money in tax for the priveledge of living here? If they don’t like it there are plenty of other places to go aren’t there?
I just wish Jersey would get away from the defacto one legged economy it is perched on. All it takes is for world wide opinion to say enough is enough and it is the end. Why wait and see?
I have travelled to many places overseas and the first comment nearly evertime on finding where I come from is to do with tax and being rich etc. I have to point out to them that just because rich people reside in Jersey, and Jersey is seen by many in the outside world, to be rich doesn’t mean everyone is loaded and gets paid in gold bars!
As per community this is the most important thing you can have as without it lies the rocky road to anarchy. If you don’t believe me look to UK council estates to see what the future holds for you. Can’t people see that possessions and money aren’t the be all and end all of our short life here on this planet?
As they say up north there are no pockets in a shrowd.
At the end of the day the world can be a better place all it takes is common sense and a sense of community and belonging.
Consumerism and capitalism will end in tears, in my honest opinion, there is no other way, as it relies on an infinite system to ply its trade. As we all know the planet is not infinite is it?
I suggest people read up on Reverend Malthus to give you a clue as to what happens when a species outgrows its resources. Or bury you head in the sands of ignorant bliss if you so prefer.
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Look on the bright side an increase of wealthy people increases your chances of settling down with one! money worries over!!hee hee! i would …use em for their money!!
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‘For everyone who has will be given more, and he will have abundance. Whoever does not have, even what he has will be taken from him’.
(Matthew 25:29)
Thanks for reminding me that this is one of the tenets of Christianity, PJ.
If only I had remembered the above verse from my schooldays I would have understood the basis of “The Jersey Way” long ago.
The verse should forthwith replace, or be added to, whatever is now on the island’s coat of arms.
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Jersey Bean, with you all the way; couldn’t agree more! Count your blessings (we have a lot to count) instead of the constant negative nit-picking of the majority of these frequently misinformed and factually inaccurate forum users.
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@ Adrian #45
“…Money is an illusion that people will fight and die for. It is only mankind that believes in this daft system, nothing else depends on this illusion besides human beings…”
Money is not an illusion; it’s a way of accounting.
Yes humans are the only that uses this system(that I can think of), but that doesn’t make it wrong, does it? What could an alternative be? perhaps those that can’t fend for themselves just get left behind to die, those that are weak get killed for what they have by those that are strong?
Suddenly a monied and taxed system isn’t so bad, surely?
But you’re looking too deeply into a simpler issue, how much taxation is fair in the modern world, today.
I say that the weak should be protected, and those that can’t fend for themselves are not left to die, by the strong; but I don’t accept that the strong should be expected to pay for every possible service to keep the poor and weak in luxury.
You propose:
“…As far as I am concerned you either:-
1.tax everyone 20p in the pound regardless of income, which could be set at a lower percentage, if everyone paid…
…
2.You draw a line in the sand at say £20,000 per person, any one above this regardless of income above this amount pays 20% on income above £20,000…”
1 or 2, black or white; I see perfectly reasonable ways of finding a middle ground, where every able to pays their way, where those that need help are given reasonable help and where those that are in a position to help others in society can do so.
I just don’t see any point in any system that is not flexible enough to recognise when one person is not pulling their weight and genuinely deserving of help given, and when another is being asked to provide more help than one person should have to bear, whether they can or not.
Is consumerism ruining the planet? yes, probably. Does this necessarily have anything to do with the issue of fair taxation? no, probably not directly.
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Adrian #35
No. Demand causes the increase in the cost of all products including property. A property is only worth what someone will pay for it. The handful of 1(1)k aren’t in demand of a 3 bed FTB house/apartment. However thousands of average earners are and it is those average earning people who increase the demand and the price. Population numbers will affect the price of the average house, but the 1(1)k population will have little, if no impact at all, in the price bracket you refer to.
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Adrian
Sorry – my opening word should have been ‘YES’ to make any sense as a response.
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