No pay-out for Woolies’ staff
Wednesday 31st December 2008, 2:58PM GMT.
WOOLWORTHS staff will not receive any redundancy payment following the closure of the store today.
More than 40 staff were yesterday told that they will receive no form of payment because Jersey does not have a redundancy compensation scheme. In the UK every member of staff receives a payment from the UK government if the firm they work for goes into administration.
But yesterday, staff – some of whom had worked at the store in King Street for 40 years – were told that they will receive nothing after the firm’s administrators, Deloitte, said that they too will not cover any redundancy package.
Anne-Marie Le Bloas, who has worked at Woolworths for 31 years and is yet to find a new job, said: ‘We are all absolutely devastated. The heart has been ripped out of town now that Woolworths has gone, and it has now been ripped out of all of us too. All our colleagues in the mainland are getting a redundancy payment from their government and we should get one from ours too.’
• Picture: Woolworths’ Jersey manager John Leggett
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Come on then Terry Le Sueur, self proclaimed “man of the people” – or some other similar rubbish – help these people with a redundancy payment. I am sure that there will not be one Jersey resident who begrudge this.
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A “Small Nation capable of great things” but still has a LONG way to catch up on EU and UK ways of treating working people. Happy New Year ??
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Why should the tax payer pay redundancy?
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It is simply because most politicians are from a buisness backround or have buisness intrests.
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Wasn’t woolies run by the UK employment act!!! Like everywhere else in Jersey no one get redundancy but unfortunately the states don’t assist like the UK gov does, its is time for Jersey to change there laws plus we pay our social security so I believe there should be some assistance available to ANYONE made redundant…..again Jersey is too taken up on getting more and more money into the island but do not want to help those in need like good honest hard working people that get made redundant….what does the states offer??????????????????? NOTHING
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Thats a very poor attitude to have John – the tax payer will not be paying for it – in the UK there is an insolvency fund set up for this situation and that is what should happen here. I am sure you would have a different view if it was you being made redundant. These people have paid there taxes into the island all their working life and most of them are local we should be supporting them.
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Why should they automatically get handouts?
It’s not like these people will have no money and no food – it will be at the discretion of the parish officials whether or not they will be supported by ratepayers money until they can find a new job, if there is an actual need then the constable and his representatives will obviously be happy to help financially.
We are not part of the UK and we do not have the same laws and the same benefits, also we do not have the same problems as they do and as such people choose to live here. If you want UK legislation and everything the same as they do “on the maindland” then why not move there?
Perhaps the people that just expect the Jersey Government to pay the same benefits as the UK Government should consider the fact that they pay considerably less back to the Government coffers – our version of VAT is considerably lower than theirs, and our taxes are also far lower.
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It’s very sad about Woolworths and the fact that no redundancy payments are to be made.
There needs to be a change in the law to protect people from this, but it would not be right to make any payments to Woolworths staff by the tax payer.
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While i do send my regards to the people who have lost their jobs i have to add that they all should have known Jersey does not have any employment laws and that they stood no chance of a payout.
If it were me i would have been job hunting the moment the news broke about the shut down.
Once the company was in administration the staff risked not getting any pay and if they are still owed wages they could still end up short!
This shows us again that retailers do not care
about the community or its staff.
Sorry to the staff but why should the tax payer pay out again for a companys mistakes.
The States should lobby the UK for money as Woolworths were at least paying tax in the UK.
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“I am sure that there will not be one Jersey resident who begrudge this.”
Well, there are at least two Andy as I agree with John.
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It will be interesting to see if attitudes towards paying redundancy soften when it is a bunch of finance professionals standing on the pavement outside a bank clutching a file box filled with the personal stuff from their desk and facing the prospect of heading off to claim support from the Constable.
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John… while I think that if Jersey has no redundancy system in place then that should apply to Woolworths’ staff as it would any other, it is rather cheeky that you forget that they ARE the taxpayer! Some of those people will have paid their taxes for decades and may have rarely used the services that those taxes supposedly pay for.
When living in Scotland I used almost none of the services that my Council tax apparently paid for, other people used those services loads (for free). If I had been in dire need I would have felt perfectly justified to ask that some of my taxes came back my way instead of only ever going to services that other people used (including people who didn’t even pay tax!)
Unfortunately it’s not really feasible to have a system where people only pay tax according to what services they use, so sometimes we need to be a little bit benevolent with those taxes since it may help people who have paid in for years but never got anything back!
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they are quick to comply to eu rules when it suits them ie all the bad ones like health issues and ordering supermarkets to charge for bags and many more ,but not so quick in bringing in the good ones like redundancy pay ,free medical health for all oaps and many more,all they are interested in is finance and tough if you don,t like it.i will be there at the rally to support the good staff at woolies and will miss it sorely only shop in town worth going to as they had fair prices with a wide variety of goods,not even worth going in town anymore.good luck to all staff at woolies just hope they can bring in a similar store that can employ all the staff young and old,not just cherry picked for fashion concious
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It seems that there was much more sympathy for the residents of the island of Sark when a number lost their jobs than there s for those who work for Woolworths. I seem to remember talk of a hardship fund and Channel Islanders pulling together against nasty outsiders.
Now in the case of Woolies we have talk of ‘these people’ choosing to live here and how much they pay in tax to the States. Still we should apparently be reassured that ‘these people’ can go cap in hand to the Parish which might in its discretion offer some financial assistance.
Quite frankly the attitude of some on this post saddens me greatly (to say the least) and before anyone suggests it no I won’t ‘get on the next boat in the morning’ and go and live somewhere else.
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When will the States of Jersey actually and positively represent the people of Jersey. They have not reacted to the need for employee protection for decades are are so out of touch its unreal. The States promised action as long ago as the Summerland debacle. There is not one States member worth a single vote for letting this situation happen again. Not one.
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This is a very sad and sorry situation whereby the ordinary working man/woman is going to suffer. To those who appear to have no sympathy and are worried about ‘their’ taxpayers money being spent helping out, do not forget that we are all taxpayers including those now out of work,and whilst we may not pay as high a tax rate as the UK, we also have to contend with a much higher standard of living. It is time Jersey got in touch with the real world, because it is not immune by any stretch of the imagination from what is happening in the UK, and, incidentally a lot of people do not like the idea of having to go begging to Social Security, Parish Constables or anywhere else, when it should be their right to have assistance. The States are a bunch of old boys network shambles with no concept or concern of how the ‘have nots’ live and struggle.
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all very sad, the unemployed staff(through no fault of their own) would prefer good steady employment as opposed to the parish hand out or what we want to call it these days.
yes we can rally round for sark but not our own.
what a disgrace.
this must bring the unemployment level to somthing not seen for along time.
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Welcome to the 18th century. The Jersey dictionary seems not to include “social justice” nor “fairness”. “Solidarity” – never heard off!
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While one commiserates with all those staff who have lost their jobs and wishes them well in their search for gainful employment, such an insovency fund would be all too redolent of the ‘something for nothing culture’ to which Mr Ozouf referred recently.
After all these people were handsomely remunerated while they were in employment and should it surely have been up to them to make provision for such an eventuality.
Quasi-Socialist schemes which undermine thrift and self-reliance among the the local workforce have no place in the ‘Jersey Way’, and if there is a place for States intervention it should be reserved to support the vital banking, agricultural and property development sectors of the island’s economy.
And from their actions – or lack thereof – it would seem that Mr Le Sueur and his colleagues understand this all too well.
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I agree that tax payers money must not be used for redundancy pay outs. Help can be given to find replacement jobs though. Also I understand retail firms have already come forward to help. I therefore do not regard this as a government problem like some people are saying on here. The workers also have to do things themselves to find work and they have had some weeks to do something already.
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‘Proud Jerseyman’ reminds me of the Jerseyman who phoned me, full of hatred against us ‘white honkies’, nearly thirty years ago, but that’s another story of course.
I would make a couple of points here. I can see the arguments for and against, and most make some sense, but to say that the workers were ‘handsomely paid’ is ridiculous. To say that they should have made provision for this is insane, and I’m certain they’ve been trying for alternative employment already.
What is the problem here is that the Jersey government, as has been said, copy the UK in many ways but are archaic in their non-support of workers.
To suggest that finance, agriculture and property development should be supported but not the retail industry is mean and absurd. Perhaps the proud Jerseyman is a farmer?
Yes, he certainly does remind me of the racist one who abused me all those years ago, or perhaps this one is just being tongue in cheek, as the phraseology suggests.
There is no provision here for such hardship as these workers may face, except going cap in hand to the States for help they should be entitled to in any responsibly governed country to which they have paid all their dues.
I choose to live here, as did, I expect, most of the local peoples’ ancestors at one time or another, and I love Jersey, but there is room for a great deal of improvement in areas such as this one. Parish assistance is a Victorian way of doing things, and must feel little short of begging.
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Of course we shouldn’t fund a private companies redundancy package. This is a failure of Jersey’s government to legislate. The most profitable store in the Wollies group yet one of few where no redundancy is to be paid – how ironic.
Offshore Finance industry has done very well again this year. But how many of the local subsidiaries will not reward staff (its already happening) due to the failure of the Group i.e. no pay increases, bonus’s etc? This might not bring a tear to the eye of some but remember Jersey has shifted its taxation from – corporations to workers, this is going to mean less tax revenue – which will effect all of you. Interest rates down – again another source of taxation to make the Corp’s better off in a more “competitive” environment. Sadly these larger parents and in this case administrators have no locality to the island which has helped them prosper, loyality is with the shareholder.
Terry needs to open his eyes.
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treating the staff with utter contempt will do jersey no favours as it was on bbc the whole world can see what a so called haven this is as they seem to think we,re all millionairs ,impossible to think there are more poor than rich another blow for jersey.when will they ever get there act together?
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At least in the UK it is not always a Government issue… the company would be legally bound to pay the staff redundancy if they could. In the case of Woolworths presumably this can’t happen but it would be good if Jersey had a system where companies that continue to trade ARE forced to pay redundancy.
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That’s a very good point, Leah, and as Woolworths seem to have had to pay their UK staff some redundancy money, they should have been forced to pay our people too.
I’m still not quite sure why they didn’t have to honour their responsibility to staff here, as Woolworth’s have operated in Jersey for so many years.
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How could wollies staff make provisions it is not high finance ,on that wage,plus most are very young?they pay tax and social for what?the government should in future combined with any employer make provisions.
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Bella’s point about Jersey adopting EU rules is spot on.
It is interesting that the EU rules that do get implemented are those that either require the setting up of a new Civil Service empire or some form of user pays charging system for the “service”. That such rules get pushed through by some senior Civil Servant claiming that we have no choice but to obey probably shows who is actually making policy. Rules for the benefit of the working person seem to be conveniently neglected by our political elite.
I am however surprised, as it seems are most people, that our new “Rolls Royce” employment laws failed to cover such an obvious situation.
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It’s nobody faults. You cannot blame the Goverment. The main reason of what’s happening is credit/finance crisis(I would call it – The end of the happy days regarding to an old economic model which doesn’t work anymore). There were not any legislation for such a situation – when people get redundent. An unemployment is bound to increase. All the Goverment can do is to provide help for people in geting another jobs.
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I agree that it is sad that the staff don’t get any redundancy packages, but why should the tax payer foot the bill?? It is only because it’s such a high profile case that politicians are throwing themselves at it. I have a friend who was laid off on New Year’s Eve after working for 30+ years in the Central Market and they aren’t getting a penny either… but I’m sure that it won’t get a second thought!!!
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you can’t really have the benefits of the UK system when Jersey people pay so little tax. Why do you pay so little tax? Because the British tax payer is basically subsidsing the island through allowing the tax evasion that keeps all Jersy tax bill so low!!!!
yes there should be a redundancy scheme, but are Jersey people willing to pay for it? Probably not as this would require some consideration of people less fortunate than themselves.
i think all these tax loopholes are coming back to haunt Jersey as islanders realise that when the going gets tough they are basically on their own as the island does not care. if you are skint then the message is go back to where you came from, be it England or anywhere else.
jersy’s politicians will probably suggest bringing back the workhouse or perhaps they think it is still open!!!! begging to the parish is oliver twist not 21st century.
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How do you justify complaining about our lower tax at the same time as facing the fact that our cost of living is much higher!
Our housing costs far more and our food and all other essentials are overpriced. We have to pay through the nose for electricity, telephone, you name it!
As for ‘go back to where you came from’ – the Island would surely grind to a standstill if everyone did that.
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I think the woolies staff should get redundancy. As the JEP reports, 9k sounds about right for the real long termers.
And if/when a big financial entity decides to make lay offs I thong the staff should also have redundancy payoffs. Make that 20k a time for the long termers.
And lets pay for it by…?
Oh, that’s when Alan Breckon, Geoff Southern and the others go silent, because the best answer is … raising GST to 4%.
The moral: if you want to give money away, it has to come from your own pockets.
The simple fact is that we are better off without Woolies. The staff were unskilled and not well paid and the profits were not taxed in Jersey because the company was not owned by Jersey residents. Anyone who wants to keep the population of Jersey below 100,000 will rejoice in its demise as it had no part to play in a sustainable future for the Island. It brought nothing to the Island and if it means that the workers there have to take jobs as cleaners or “baristas” in cafe shops rather than imported labour then that is a good thing.
My vision is for a population no more than 90,000 all earning a good standard of living. What is wrong with that?
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“watchthisspace Posted January 2, 2009 at 3:17 pm
Offshore Finance industry has done very well again this year. ”
I can only presume you dont work in offshore finance. Profits are well down and most people are hoping to keep their jobs. No pay rises for 2009, thats for sure. The statistics lag the facts by about 6/9 months. In the summer you can tell me I am right.
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MTK the Woolworths situation is not straight forward as Woolworths Group is a bigger company than you see on the street. It may well be that there is money still in the overall Woolworths Group, certainly at the time of shares stopping trading elements of the company (though not the shops) WERE profit making. The banks called in loans and that is why Woolworths had to stop its shops from trading. If this is the case then it would take some seriously amoral beings to not be paying redundancy to their staff!
Matt, as one who has been made redundant three times in the past I can assure you that I am thinking of everyone who is being made redundant in this current financial climate, not just Woolworths staff. There does need to be some kind of system in place for people being made redundant but it has to benefit all people that are made redundant and I for one will not pretend to know how that could really work in an island where tax is very low relative to the UK.
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Mad Foetus, you do make an interesting point about the Woolies staff finding work elsewhere. I believe that by Jersey law people that were born and educated here should be given priority when it comes to jobs, so presumably they will be able to find other work (if they are willing to do it) as there are currently many non-Jersey born or educated people serving in cafes, restaurants and doing hotel work.
And I speak as a non-Jersey born and/or educated person who will watch with interest what happens if and when the Woolies staff try to apply for other jobs on the island. From what I have seen in my short time here, Jersey has this law (and I believe for good reason) but fails to implement it, either that or people are getting very good at finding loopholes in it or there are simply no Jersey people willing to ‘lower’ themselves to do these jobs? I don’t know what the answer is to that one, anyone?
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‘Jersey workers face worst employment laws in western world..’
T&G Union headlines dated 8 Nov 2004
Andy Frampton, the T&G regional secretary covering the island, said the plans were not just anti-trade union they undermined hard fought for rights for individuals as well as collective rights.
“If these changes go through, Jersey will have the worst employment rights in the Western world,” he said before the meeting. “The government describe their plans as ‘Fair Play’ but we see nothing fair about them at all.”
“We see these proposals undermining rights to redundancy pay, protection against discrimination and protection of pay, terms and conditions if your job is being transferred,” he explained. “Far from making progress these laws, if passed, will become a charter for bad employers to exploit workers with impunity. In 2004 that cannot be right.”
The Employment (Jersey) Law 2003 has failed the real people of Jersey once again. The Unions said that it favoured the employers rather than the employees, this employment law that was modelled on a failed Thatcherite economics.
The shocking thing is that the majority of the house voted it in despite being warned…
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The sooner people learn what laws are in place in Jersey the better. And that is especially aimed at Geoff Southern and his beloved JDA. I actually find this whining disgusting. People get made redundant in Jersey all the time so why should Woolworth staff be treat any different to anybody else? The JDA should be ashamed of themselves for using such a case for cheap political point scoring.
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Re mad foetus. I’m quite sure I’m not wrong. Some business maybe down on targets in 08 but overall still very profitable in this locality. Internationally they may have faltered, but most local business will be passing up a profit (and a substantial one) to their parents not a loss. We will then see a readjustment and I’m sure redundancies – but this doesn’t mean no profit.
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As a small employer in Jersey we find it hard enough to find the right skilled people as it is. If the Goverment starts introducing even more red tape on workers rights then we will probably have to shut up shop like others already.
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Jersey normally has close to full employment and so redundancy payments would be a waste of taxpayers’ money. If a trust company closes down the staff are usually snapped up straight away – so why do they deserve extra pay? What is required is a system to help the temporarily unemployed local person, especially in a period of recession, and guaranteed pensions thast are portable.
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If there is indeed a law or requirement for locally born or residentially qualified persons to take priority for jobs, it is certainly not being put in place. I am aware of one vacancy left by a non-British person that has not been advertised openly, but by word of mouth has been filled by another non-British person with neither of the criteria being met either. This by one of the Islands bigger employers too. What hope is there, or will there be for those who have lived and worked here all their lives. Surely we should take precedent and also why are these jobs not advertised? Could ‘cheap labour’ be the answer??
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We pay taxes including GST on everything including food so our government can target those who are needy with benefits.
Does this situation not show how wise our elected reps were not to exclude food from GST?
All Woollies staff are now unemployed, “some” not all will now be needy, some may still have good household incomes coming in and may be enjoying the rest until their next job.
Needy people are targeted with many benefits payed for by taxing those still earning its called our welfare society.
Woolworths will not be the only casualties of the credit crunch. we have safety nets in place, we have ways we are paying for those safety nets.
Lets not get silly and give out payments from the public purse to all, needy or not.
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Proud Jerseyman – you remind of those monsters from the early 20th century that refused to give parachutes to early RFC and RAF pilots because they thought it would be bad for morale. The reason that redundancy pay is important, apart from all of the moral arguments, is that it prevents the economy losing out on consumers and so keeps the whole capitalist process working. If people have no money, they can’t buy things. If people lose their jobs through no fault of their own they need to be compensated by the useless management that lost them their jobs. When big companies come in to Jersey they should be made to set aside contingency funds against the eventuality of having to meet redundancy payment demands. No tax payers money involved. A bit like investor protection legislation and many other pieces of law that have never been introduced because it might inconvenience the banks and the trust companies.
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