Jobs: Recession starts to bite
Saturday 10th January 2009, 10:00AM GMT.
JOBS are being shed as the recession starts to bite in Jersey.
Since the New Year, firms have been contacting the Jersey Advisory and Conciliation Service on a daily basis to ask for advice on what to do to comply with laws governing staff layoffs. The inquiries have come from firms in finance, retail and construction and look likely to continue to flood in.
Meanwhile, a senior banker has predicted that about 500 jobs are likely to be shed as finance businesses cut back on staff numbers. And a leading builder’s merchant is forecasting tough times ahead for the construction sector.
Pentagon Builder’s Merchants have made a call for the planning process to be speeded up to allow more construction work to get under way. JACS director David Witherington (pictured) said that since the start of January the organisation had seen a significant increase in the number of inquiries from firms which were preparing to reduce staffing levels.
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and I thought we were told that there was no recession and that Jersey was immune from what happened in the rest of the world?
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What recession, there isnt one in Jersey. Terry sad so himself so it must be true.
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Can anyone remember what our newly elevated Chief Minister said only a little while ago ” There is no recession in Jersey ,better get the boy Phil to transfer some of the rainy day fund to the Income support fund i think we are going to need it !
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will they be asking the states for redundancy pay too?
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This is sensationalist journalism. There have been no major layoffs and the JEP have quoted a senior unamed banker (well we all know how much you can trust a banker). This is a story of little substance. McRandle come back when you have some actual facts.
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So states how are you going to support these people that will be made redundant? After all you did say Jersey wouldn’t be effected….isn’t it time to start putting your heads together and working out something to assist the people of Jersey…rather than all talk and not action….
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Few tears will be shed over those in the finance industry that lose their jobs, when this current crisis can be shown to have been created by the rampant greed of those that control and manipulate our money.
Those that work hard and take the least from society are those that are suffering and help should be focused on them.
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Just shows the credibility of our Chief statesmen. How naive to thing that a global recession would not hit this ‘protected’ little rock!!
It was bound to happen and has done so, sooner rather than later.Perhaps our esteemed elected will be prepared to take a cut in salary to assist those poor finance workers who will now have to learn to manage like the rest of the ‘have nots’ in Jersey.
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In these hard times, please give some thought to the hard working Jersey people. Why bring in outside construction workers, when we have them already in the island, possibly facing redundancies. The powerful, so called States Members should remember who pays their wages and listen to the good old Jersey folk!
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Hey everyone “calm down” whats the problem here??
If Mr le suer says theres no recession then there is no recession. There a “clever” bunch in the states and yet your all getting upset over nothing! as the message is loud and clear or are you forgetting? “Jersey: Life enriching”!!!!!!
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I heard someone say the other day that the only jobs safe in this current climate are teachers and undertakers.To “Realistic Jerseyman” comment no 7 while I agree completely with your last sentence I don’t think that “everyone” who works in finance should be tarred with the same brush.The industry seems to have become the target of many peoples anger and disgust in Jersey(and I understand why as it is the only industry the majority of politicians seem to care about)but please bear in mind that not everyone who works within it is a multi-millionaire.
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100% Completely agree with Beano Bull “This is sensationalist journalism. There have been no major layoffs and the JEP have quoted a senior unamed banker (well we all know how much you can trust a banker). This is a story of little substance. McRandle come back when you have some actual facts.’ – And as for ‘Realistic Jersey man’, the reason for the Credit Crisis and subsequent downturn, stems from the lack of regulation by the American government, not from the bankers themselves. They were out to make as much profit as possible, which is the goal of any comapny, while staying within the law, which they did. To explain it to you in terms you might be able to relate to, it’s the equivalent of the EU taking away fishing quotas and expecting fisherman to regulate themselves. Does that seem realistic to you?
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Stop being so negative , we need to pull together thats the way to get out of this mess,not pointing fingers
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Realistic Jerseyman states that few tears will be shed over people in finance losing their jobs. (comment No.7) Why is that I wonder. After all, these people work hard, pay their taxes, and are entitled to a decent days pay. Isn’t this why we encourage our children to go to school, pass exams to go to college and do well so they too can have comfortable lives and enjoy the luxuries instead of scrimping and saving and being part of that dependancy culture that seems to be growing at an alarming rate on this island.
And I doubt for a minute that it will be the fat cats that lose their jobs, but the ordianary Joe that has a family, mortgage/rent, bills to pay and mouths to feed like the rest of us.
The more people that lose their jobs, the more this will become a strain on our already failing government. In some parts of the UK, children are being pulled out of fee paying schools as the once affluent are not so affluent anymore. Now they are seeing a huge strain on the government schools.
Regardless of what job you do, anyone who faces reduncy is going to have an impact on us all.
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With layoffs within the construction industry, is the developer which requested 500 accomodation places still asking for this amount or are they reducing this number and looking at employing local labour?
If this is not the case, surely somone is a position of authority within the States should be looking more closely at this and other outside companies entering the Island to protect the interests of our local workforce.
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I agree with Realistic Jerseyman. It’s hard to feel sorry for an industry that has caused the worldwide credit crisis in the first place. Locally it has given so much materialistically to an, admittedly large, minority; yet taken so much of the soul and character out of the island. Ultimately it will turn out to be a price not worth paying in my opinion.
Greed isn’t good after all, and that industry is the one that needs to learn that lesson for when the recovery does come, otherwise it will happen all over again. Less powerful influence and good regulation are key, contraction will help to achieve these.
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If finance starts to go then everything else will start to go with it. These 500 figures are pie in the sky anyhow. We are currently looking for people at my place so it doesn’t add up. Maybe for the banks that have been taken over by the Givernment there could be job losses perhaps.
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Realistic Jerseyman – you should be aware that the people responsible for this crisis are only a small number of those who work in banks. Most of us are as angry as you that their greed has resulted in ordinary people losing their jobs.
A large number of islanders work for financial institutions and have families and mortgages to support. They are in no way responsible for the present downturn but are the ones who will suffer for it.
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Marcel, there may be some faults with the industry as a whole, but the ordinary person who is processing your pay cheque at the end of the month, (assuming you have a job that is) can’t be blamed, and those are the people who will be laid off, not the top dogs making the decisions.
And as much as you may not like to hear this, if the finance industry wasn’t so big in this island, Jersey’s economy would have collapsed years ago.
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That is a stupid comment Realistic Jerseyman.
You should shed a tear or two for the people who work in finance, these are every day people who pay taxes and support the local economy. The knock on effect of job losses is that the finance workers will be forced to spend less in other industries, that in turn causes more redundancies and so on. It is a vicious circle. How do you think this island is so well off in the first place, it’s not through tourism or agriculture.
I work in recruitment and know of a number of firms that will be laying off staff. So we should all take this article very seriously. As it will happen and soon..
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Will the new potato company employ some of the laid off builders – or as usual import cheaper labour from elsewhere.
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Moving to Guernsey – those you say that are to be laid off, are they contracts, temps or full time employees? If it’s the latter of the 3 it’s potentially more serious.
If my memory serves me TlS said there was no evidence of a recession in Jersey “YET”. And if there was a recession then Jersey would not be as badly affected as the UK. He did NOT say we would never be affected by a recession or experience one. Anyway staff loses are not signs of a recession – negative growth is. A lot of staff lay offs could be down to natural turnover or firms using the ‘recession’ as an excuse to lose fat. Too early to say for sure.
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why employ locals when you can get half price others? it is greed,just making rich richer as they don,t give us anything cheaper.you just have to look at house prices to see this,not built by locals who can,t even afford to buy them,something drastically wrong here and you don,t need a chystal ball to see this.
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Will the laid of builders, want to work digging potatoes, i dont think so!!
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I am a Jerseywoman & work within the finance industry. I am working class and have never had a holiday abroad. Get real mr Jerseyman. We all have to earn a crust. What do you do for a living?
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The enormous sums of cash from finance have given opportunity and money to thousands of youngsters who would have left otherwise – just look at places like Cornwall and Cumbria, where the locals would rip off their arms for our job opportunities and where the absence of decent jobs has meant for most people that picturesque means poverty. This is an ill wind that will blow no-one any good in this island.
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Yes I agree with everyone it was the fat cats who caused this mess in finnace not the ordinary joe who cashes your pay cheque – but is it just me that found everyone that worked in finance a bunch of arrogant, snooty individuals that look down on any other industry. I look forward to more news of redundancies.
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Mark Willis says – “Everyone who works in finance -a bunch of arrogant snooty individuals. I look forward to more redundancies”. Most people in finance work hard long hours and are certainly not all fat cats. Make them redundant and who is going to pay for Mark’s hospital treatment, the brilliant educational facilities here, etc. etc. Yes, a large part is financed by the finance workers, all who pay tax to pay for Mark’s facilities.
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19. Big Bean…you are totally correct and spot on. Your last paragraph should be read carefully.
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Unfortunately it is all three that are being affected joker
Just look at Savills pulling out of the island reported in tonight’s paper, a few others have recently laid people off without much press coverage. A number of places have recruitment freezes on at the moment whilst they consolidate the current work force before looking for cost cuts.
Also I think it is only fair to say, if we only spent the money we have saved then we would also not be in this mess. The banks do not force us at gunpoint to take out these loans. I do disagree with the readiness that money has been loaned to people but we all have a choice. I personally do not have credit cards or loaned or an overdraft for that matter. My wages are average for the island and I am able to afford to live. Okay I do not drive a flash car and do not have a big house but what I do have suits me.
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Realistic Jerseyman – What a selfish thing to say! Yes, those high up in the industry can afford to lose a bit, and perhaps can even be “blamed” for this, if blame can be given, but I think it is a shallow and baseless thing to say that no tears will be shed over those in finance! Ordinary hard working people work in finance too, and all they want is to earn an honest crust.
I think you really need to grow up and stop looking at things in such a black and white way. It’s pathetic.
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Looking forward to more redundancies? Oh come on …no one deserves to lose their job.
I agree a minor proportion of the public get paid far too hefty salaries for the jobs they do, but the majority of the public are hard workers – striving to pay their mortgages, rent and to buy food – essesntials required to live comfortably.
Think before you comment…before someone wishes you lose your job (if you have one in the first place)
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As I commented earlier-many people think that everyone in the finance industry is milking millions out of it which is obviously not the case if you think logically about it.As some have stated here many of those employed within finance are simply working hard and being paid a fair salary to enable them to provide a decent standard of living for themselves and family.If you have studied hard at school/university and gained hefty qualifications then surely this is something to be commended.Yet there appears to be great bitterness and anger against these people.Why?What would anger me far more if I still lived in Jersey is the enormous rise in people who could be working but who are now living off the States, as it is now possible to do, and contributing absolutely nothing.To wish redundancy on anyone is cruel.
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It dosent matter who you are or what you do redundancy will have the same effect on everyone. Weather your high up in the finance industry or working at the local shop its all the same we all deserve to keep our jobs regardless of our status and it would be unsensitive to think otherwise. This is the calm before the storm and I think at the moment we are all feeling unsettled.
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We are all in the same boat no matter what job we have got and this is just the calm before the storm. It is true to say that is a very unsettling time for us all.
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The safest job to be in when Jersey goes into tough times and always has been is the offshore finance industry. Specifically Trust/Accountancy and investment work.
The building trade is always the to suffer and then their suppliers. But if you want to have stablilty during tough times, offshore finance is pretty well a safe bet.
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It must also be remembered that there are the service industries who also rely on the finance industry. If finance houses close down it will not just be finance workers who will be affected.
They all need stationary supplied, delivered and printed, printers and photocopiers need services and repairs, every one of them has a PC on their desk which has to be supplied and delivered, they employ window cleaners etc….. they buy sandwiches for their lunches. The list is endless
The Potteries etc do a roaring trade in corporate parties and places like Mange Tout practically exist on the finace industry workers. Will they all start laying off staff as work thins out? You can bet on it.
In short, the knock on effect will hit numerous other businesses, small and large, who feed off them. They contribute considerably to the economy of the island irrespective of their personal or corporate tax arrangements.
Be careful what you wish for.
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Remeber Jersey shifted its taxation burden to employees from corporations. Layoffs mean less tax receipts, less in bonus’s mean less tax receipts. People will have less money to spend as a result of this combined with 20 means 20 and GST and the wider economy will suffer.
States spending relevant to the private sector is out of control and must be pulled in. Whatever the real state of offshore finance the larger parents will be laying off and “right sizing” for sure based on what 2009 looks like, partly its an excuse to bin people and go to lower cost locations or services. All that said doesn’t mean these business’s are making a loss.
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I have noticed that Realistic Jerseyman has still not revealed what he does for a living. Are we to assume that he is a ‘kept man’?
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While i am sure no one on this site would like to see people lose their jobs i have to disagree with those people who claim Jersey will die if Finance disappeared.
If Finance died tomorrow the Ferry / Plane back home would be busy.
After the mass exodos back home it would leave the people who want to stay on Jersey and live a basic but healthy lifestyle, so therefore there is less stress on the infrastucture, less traffic, less building work, less everything!
Perfect.
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You can’t just place the blame on bankers for the financial mess we’re in. Just about everyone is to blame in some way for the financial crisis and we all rode the wave of wealth for a while. Everyone enjoyed the benefit (some more than others) and everyone will feel the pain of the correction (some more than others). That’s life folks. Get busy livin’ or get busy dieing.
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I have a very good job, thank you, Big Bean.
The finance sector as a whole has an over inflated view of how important it is though. Yes, tax intake from the thousands of bank clerks pays for a lot of services, but the really worthwhile jobs (and, no, I am not employed as one of them) are the likes of our nurses, teachers, police officers etc.
They contribute far more real value to our way of life, and yet perversely get paid proportionately a lot less. Still, they do get the satisfaction of doing something really worthwhile with their lives. Unlike the rest of us who just take the money.
To a large extent our ‘way of life’ may hinge upon the finance industry, but let’s get things in perspective, our actual lives don’t. Not every nice island to live in in the world is an offshore finance centre.
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bella Posted January 12, 2009 at 12:09 pm “why employ locals when you can get half price others?”
thats not entirely true as the island bring in lots of high paid J category people as Jersey hasnt got enough educated locals to do the jobs
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Marcel
I have to disagree that the police “perversely get paid proportionately a lot less”.
You need no qualifications whatsoever to get in and the starting salary is emmense with many of them after two years earning well over £50k pa.
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to Pink Panther:
it’s put very good. The life on the island has been good for a long time. Nothing can last forever. It’s impossible to change something. Just have a look at Uk’history – you hardly find a very long period of happy days. But the question is what average people should do ?
Any ideas ?
Thanks
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anna i,m talking about the building jobs i know loads of plumbers carpenters etc who can,t find work as employers are getting others at minimum wage and the house prices don,t come down,just the bosses making more money
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Now is the time for the States to create jobs. They should now consider and implement the big projects that have been put off for too long. Recession, in my opion, only happens when people start to feel insecure about their jobs, they stop spending money and jobs go. If there’s job security, people will spend and this will stimulate more jobs.
What projects could be undertaken?
~ a light railway between St Helier and St Brelade and the airport.
~ a barrage across the bay as recently suggested in the JEP.
~ heaven forbid – but what about that bridge to France?
True, it all costs money – we have a rainy day fund, don’t we?
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The police here get a pretty good salary in comparison to the UK, and do not have to face anything like the level and severity of crime there. So let’s get things into proportion – it is not exactly the adrenalin fuelled, challenging job that we usually associate with police forces elsewhere. Nurses I am sure deserve better, and teachers do very nicely thank you.
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unfortunatly Andrew they will get in outside contractors to do the job which will be designed by a London firm and import the worker. so what exactly will be the benefit to Jersey? none of these entities will even end up paying Jersey tax
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I think Jersey could avoid a recession through encouraging the island to become more independent. Employing contracters from outside the island and importing workers because it is cheaper does not benefit the local people neither does it encourage confidence for local business in fact it kills them. There are plenty of local small businesses that could expand and generate jobs with a little help from the states.
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“Looking forward to more redundancies”. The sad reality my friend is that whether you like it or not the finance industry is the driving force behind Jerseys economy and the backbone of the welfare system.
If the finance industry collapses I am sure that some of the posters here will have some initial jubilation. However, when the shops start to close as the unemployed no longer buy goodies and the service industry to the finance sector folds (IT, deliveries, sandwich shops, office supplies, builders, window cleaners, local landlords renting out accommodation to staff – even air links) and they can no longer get their income support as the States pot is empty, they will be lamenting at their poverty stricken leisure.
Don’t forget that the rainy day fund isn’t all that big when you realise that it costs half a BILLION pounds a year to run this island.
We all have bills to pay and a lot of us have families to support. To wish unemployment on someone is a horrible thing to desire. Lets hope karma doesn’t come and bite you!
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Andrew – you can’t have it both ways. Politicians are hardly going to agree to increased spending when for years they have received public criticism for spending too much, especially in these thrifty times.
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Joker: I don’t want it both ways. Spending on frivolities is out of order and this should be critisized – and there’s plenty examples of these. However, spending money on schemes that could save us money, increase our prosperity and strengthen our independance should be wholly encouraged and endorsed. What’s the age-old adage – speculate to accumulate? There’s nothing wrong with spending, just being careful with what you spend it on. Did someone say de Faye?
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Joker.
Thats exactly what a good government should do. React speedily to current circumstances.
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was it really the fat cats that caused all the problems or is it the accountancy rules of the 60 or so off-shore finance centers or tax havens call it what you want !Lets face it if the rules were the same they would no longer be there doing what they are doing like the Northern rock, so i’m not talking about the normal banking
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Spring Heeled Jack i totally DISAGREE
read my comment No 40.
Look around the world and look at all the other small islands who do not survive on Finance.
Now compare this to Bermuda…A perfect island over run with Finance and over crowding.
Just look at Google Earth and you will see what Finance has done to Bermuda.
Now look at Jersey… Heading the same way.
I beleive that if Finance disappeared that yes it would be tough for a year or two while the island restructured but please dont stand there and preach that Finance is God!
Money is the root of all evil.
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I agree with what you say Mark G. However, it is the love of money that is the root of all evil, not money per se. And, by golly, does Jersey love its money!
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When the finance and skilled jobs have gone, along with the workforce, all that will be left are the locals wanting a ridiculous wage to sweep roads.
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No one wishes unemployment on anyone but this island cannot be successfull on the finance industry alone. There is an ever increasing gap between the rich and the working class. If finance companies go down then what does the island have left to fall back on. Not alot and yes finance is not god! The island does need to cut back on employing people from outside the island so that more jobs can be created from and for islanders. Its not to say that we shouldnt have people coming over here but simply that some restrictions need to be put in place.
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Mark G: “Look around the world and look at all the other small islands who do not survive on Finance.”
No island has a comparable GDP to Jersey without a finance industry.
Others will either have a thriving tourism insdustry (which Jersey simply cannot have these days) or will have a relatively low GDP and not be very well developed in terms of education, employment, health etc.
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Spot on Pink Panther. What we should have been doing for years is encourgaing diversification – which is going to be increasingly difficult in the present economic and political climate.
I hope you all bear this in mind at the next elections- particularly those who voted for the new “finance district”!
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Reply to ‘Realistic Jerseyman’I don’t know why you feel so bitter about bank workers. Finance has created the majority of work in Jersey and Jersey folk have reaped the benefits over the years. There is a global crisis at the moment and that is not the fault of the bank workers in Jersey!
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Mark G
You could not be more wrong.
The only people that could afford to stay on the island are the people who have no mortgage to repay, even then what would they have to stay for?
Look at the situation with the sub prime debt in America for example
If finance left the island, house prices would crash, people would be unable to pay their mortgage due to the lack of salary and would then have their homes repossessed, the states would struggle without all the tax and be unable to pay for all the service sector staff and civil servant staff, shops would fail, service companies would fail, farming and agriculture would then fail.
What is left then?
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Technically there is no recession in Jersey as a recession occurs when the size of the economy decreases in 3 a month period for 2 consecutive 3 month periods. However, the recession in the UK is effecting Jersey as companies that have locations in Jersey but have parent companies abroad e.g. Horseplay, Wallace and Barnaby and Woolies are suffering from the recession and have therefore gone into administration or have had to downsize. This is what happened to these companies as even Woolies has stated that their Guernsey and Jersey branches were there top performing branches i.e. the Jersey branch didn’t close, it would still be performing well due to the Jersey economy being stable. There is currently no recession in Jersey but the World recession is always going to effect us and because of this, it is likely a recession will start in Jersey, especially if Jersey branches, owned by English companies continue to close.
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Who or what is Working Class ?
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John
Working Class is both an attitude and a label you can and should be proud of it. If you are one of the Working Class however, it is a socio economic stratum looked down on by the Middle Classes who by definition have come from the Working Class.
Otherwise they would have come from the Upper Class and still consider themselves Upper Class (but distressed or broke to the rest of us). You cannot migrate to the Upper Class by social mobility you have to be born to it.
Simply put if you are born a zebra you will die a zebra and not a goat. So all those very rich people you see; might be any of the three classes depending on birth attitude and wealth.
Working Class people tend to wear a suit without a tie, flat cap, muffler (scarf) and smoke roll-ups. A dead give away is a whippet which they tend to hang around with for intellectual stimulation. You might also see this sort of chap feed said whippet beer from an ashtray in his local boozer.
The Middle Classes can be distinguished at home by the use of the ‘Dado Rail’. This is a sort of ‘Picture Rail’ but much lower and totally useless. Whilst on the subject; never hang a picture so that you have to look up to it, why would you do that? Hang it at eye level it makes far more sense.
It is also important to note that the middle classes never swear and all their small female offspring wear pink Wellington boots and skip. Appearance is everything to the middle classes as they have to be seen to have arrived and to be better off than the middle class person next door; look for people carriers and twin buggies.
The Upper Classes are totally inaccessible by migration and you can only enter it if not by birth then by marriage. In the case of marriage you can only do this as a woman as you only have to keep your mouth shut and wear a twinset and pearls to look the part.
As a bloke you would be looked upon as a social climber, however historically this was the preferred route of social advancement, marry an upper class wife and lie about your origins (elocution lessons, tweeds (not in town) and a Labrador would help carry it off)
Appearance is also everything the Upper Classes; however they are sure of their social status so dress like a bag of proverbial and their young male offspring always have incredibly snotty noses. As a rough guide the upper classes are as grubby and scruffy as the working classes but without the whippet. One final important pointer is that both the Upper and Working Classes swear like troopers and are totally comfortable in each others company, they are united by mutual contempt of the middle class.
If you are trying finally to distinguish between a working class brat and an Upper Class one go for the Hoody and the Burberry Baseball Cap a dead give away every time.
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Whatever:
you quoted “Others will either have a thriving tourism insdustry (which Jersey simply cannot have these days) or will have a relatively low GDP and not be very well developed in terms of education, employment, health etc”
So you agree that islands can survive without Finance.
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Moving to Guernsey:
You quote “What is left then?”
As i quoted “I beleive that if Finance disappeared that yes it would be tough for a year or two while the island restructured”
You all go on as though Jersey would die if Finance left the island but i say that it would survive.
20 years ago would you have said Dubai would lose its oil?
Would you have not said that Dubai will die if it loses it oil?
Look at Dubai today.
Doe this answer your question.
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Sorry Borris there are only 2 classes in Jersey…
Haves and Have nots!
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Nellie, etc. Jersey is nothing without finance… It has nothing else to offer, no matter how much you want it too
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