GST could go above 3%, warns Chief Minister
Saturday 14th February 2009, 9:59AM GMT.
GST might have to rise above three per cent if savings or tax revenue decline significantly in the coming years, says the Chief Minister.
Senator Terry Le has Sueur warned that Islanders could have to face the prospect of higher taxation as he revealed that GST was on track to achieve the target of raising £50 million this year.
He said that States economists and statisticians were already attempting to forecast what the likely impact a recession would have on the tax take – particularly on income tax. He suggested that income tax receipts were likely to dip in the coming years and that steps would be needed to keep the economy on track. That could mean raising tax in other ways, possibly by leaning more heavily on GST.
Senator Le Sueur said that the latest figures indicated that GST would achieve its target. ‘We have figures for more than half-way through the year and the current indications confirm that trend,’ he explained. ‘GST has been in place for the best part of a year and we have been able to put money into the Stabilisation Fund, which I am sure we are going to be grateful for in the years to come.
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here we go… the prewarming has begun. What a surprise
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Shock horror!!!
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We knew this all along. Thats why we said no to GST
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Well done States Members !!
Lets put up GST so we have more tax payers money to waste.
Cut your coat according to your cloth, as every business has to do. Jersey is a business.
Does that mean every business having a hard time should raise their prices? It doesn’t work.. Trim your costs.
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What a surprise, despite all his protestations to the contrary during the debate about GST good old Le Sueur is warning us that he is likely to raise the rate from 3%. So in the middle of what is predicted to be the worst recession in 100 years, the tax burden on the poor consumer will go up even further.
The anti GST politicians said this would happen and were vilified as scaremongers. The truly scary people are the Council of Ministers who are completely out of their depth. We have effectively a Parish council trying to run a national economy.
First they are going to squander the rainy day fund and then they are going to raid our pockets. All in an attempt to keep the rich ruling elite in the manner they believe they are entitled to.
Why did the electorate of Jersey trust these people?
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Here comes the thin end of the wedge……
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most of us said this will happen, any one know where i can post the shirt of my back to?
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And so it begins…
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Dear ‘all inclusive’ Terry,
Why don’t you hold a public consultation to see what the public really think.
On second thoughts, perhaps not…you might have a public dissorder event to deal with.
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Why are we not surprised !!!!!
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“We’ll spend it all” he said.
“Yes” our money. The greed dragon has come out of its lair waiting to give its poor predators a “spring suprise” of discontentment, let’s say 6%
GST. Nothing quite like “Life enriching” Jersey!
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Taxation in Jersey used to be mainly based on income. Those on the lowest incomes still do not pay income tax but we all have to eat. GST is proportionately a greater burden on those with the lowest incomes an so is a very bad type of tax, especially at this time.
I assume that does not worry the Chief Minister who only seems to want get in as much tax as possible without placing the burden on those with the highest incomes.
There will be a considerable reduction in the income tax soon due to the very low interest rates. This is the fault of Incapability Brown and we can do nothing about that.
The only answer is to reduce the population of Jersey rather than allowing to increase. That way we would have less expenses of imported power, water, sewage and waste disposal. We also need to find sources of income other than the finance industry which will soon be in decline.
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you surprise no one terry just think how high the cost of living will be if you put up GST 6.4% or 10.4% or will it stay at the rate that suits the states of 3.3% stand down now terry.
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why don’t you just put it @ 15% (as per VAT) we all know thats where your going, save time and do it!
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Get rid of the ‘J’ cats and raise the GST even more – sounds right !
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We MUST find savings even before we start to look at increasing the tax burden.
A few suggestions
1. Stop the rent rebates were landlords have got rich to the tune of £25million (of tax payers money) each year.
2. Stop the never ending use of outside expensive consultant who have no appreciation of the specialness of Jersey.
3. Stop wasting money on luxury projects that are not necessary and are only done because some “want” them but we don’t necessarily need them.
I’m sure others could add to this list – but will the States listen? I doubt it; they didn’t listen to the 19000 who signed the Anti GST petition so what gives us any hope that they will listen now?
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Why?
If GST is on target why raise it?
What has TLS got in mind to spend extra money on?
There is something he has in mind to waste our money on. Yes more money wastage!!!
I say make states income and expenditure public as it is our money and we should have a right to see income and expenditure accounts.
Who is going to end up living in Jersey? Only the rich who can afford it.
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instead of talking about raising gst is it not about time the states brought out their ideas for the way they are going to get some of the money back from companies that are owned outside the island and are no longer paying any form of tax. only 11 months to 2010 and still no word.
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Never thought I would say this, but I actually believe Terry this time! Certainly do not agree with him, think it’s totally immoral (unlike taxing 1.1K residents any more than the peanuts they pay) but I do know this one will happen.
If you don’t like it, there’s a boat in the morning. And in 2011 it will look like the fall of Saigon all over again and it will the locals finally going. That will be Terry’s political epitath, the man that drove out those pesky locals once and for all.
But with a name like Le Sueur will he not be the person who betrayed us in a way that only Quisling could admire after he seized power in Norway and told them that he had some new friends from Germany coming over!
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This on top of 20 means 20 this year will be the end of the midlle class
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This Island will indeed become available “only” for the 4×4, Mini “what an ugly car” driving brigade. According to newsletter February 2009 one supermarket has put the price of bread up 70%!
in a year!!!! Yes i did say 70!
Just a thought,who will clean up after the rich if we ordinary mortals leave this “Life empooring”
island????
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Excuse me GST will have to raise above 3 % if tax revenue decline? Of course tax revenue is going to decline as more and more people become unemployed.Except states members on their healthy wage paid by the public. The usual states scenario is to act without much thought upstairs. Put GST up at your peril, then you will put more inhabitants of this island on the bread line, who in turn will need more fiancial help from income support.So where are you saving money ?? A bit like Robin Hood except you take from the poor to keep the rich.
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How about a Capital Gains Tax?
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Well there’s a surprise. And we’re all still waiting to see how things are going with GST at the current rate!
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I thought that the States were under the obligation that GST could not rise above its initial rate of 3% for three years after it was brought in. It would be an incredible move considering the opposition we saw in May of last year.
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months before the introduction of GST, during Terry’s consultation period, at every single meeting TLS and his group of merry men were told there were other ways to raise money and then TLS
stated (and there must be written records of this in the JEP) We will not raise GST for the first 3 years ….now today we learn GST may go up………..
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Check out the States website for the job of chief officer for transport & technical service with a salary of around £124,000!
At least the applicant needs to have 5 years residency, but then it’s probably been created to help a senior civil servant move positions without being bumped out. Add this to the final salary pension they probably get and you have a great stitch up job performed on the people of Jersey, yet again. This, along with the incinerator fiasco shows you where the money from GST is needed even in this glorious island, the 4th richest society in the world.
Makes you wonder why we got that title but we desperately have to claw back every penny from those who can barely afford to heat their homes and others can drive around in Bentleys, Maseratis and 4x4s.
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i have to pay g.s.t on my utility bills and food and that’s all i don’t spend anything, i never go to the shops, i buy everything on line, i don’t eat in restaurants i do all that when i’m away, i think even with the introduction of g.s.t they get less from me than before, so if others do the same as i do they must be losing in many ways, they actually should be thinking of scrapping it as it was brought in at the wrong time, why i won’t pay it is because of the reason it was brought in so non island people can avoid tax. i really don’t spend anything any more [in jersey!] trust me i even walk to w.h smith to buy my t.v guide as they don’t charge it and i save 3 pence ,it’s the principle!
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So the Island really will go bust. It looks like the fortune tellers of gloom were right all the time….
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Come on, this was inevitable. People in Jersey need to get organised and demonstrate en masse. Get rid of these fools and vote for people with integrity.
It also seems like someone needs to give a basic lesson to the States on the tax burden vs. tax revenue curve.
On the plus side, at the rate they are destoying the economy in Jersey I might be able to afford to retire to Jersey, but then again why would I with these idiots in charge.
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I’m a little confused. TLS is telling CTV that he is not considering raising GST, but warning the JEP that he might.
Either Terry is as confused as I am, or one of our media moguls has got it wrong!
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Cayman islands here i come!!!
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If a family is having a bad time financially they first cut out the luxuries. The head of the family sits his family around the kitchen table to discuss their needs and ambitions. One of the older members wants to spend one hundred million pounds on renovating the house that provides accommodation for the non earning family members which includes himself.This member a few days later wants to throw out the family members who pay for the food and shelter of the non subscribing members. As the father is unable to make this older member see sense he gives a politically correct clout.
Ted, with your head in the clouds I know that you will only take advice from highly paid imported advisers and not us mere mortal tax payers that will provide for your ivory tower.
And it all started with the payment of States Members.
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Just call it VAT whack it up to 15% or higher and have done with it. Then Jersey will become an annex of the UK. We have all been told lie upon lie by the establishment and it will come home to roost, but the Members won’t care, they will all be well paid and retire on a golden handshake.
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Income tax receipts down, so up goes GST. Surly if the shortfall is within Income Tax, we should raise Income Tax. Problem, will too many leave the island and ease the pressure on island resources?
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they’re on a roll with this one,now we are being told there was a clause allowing them to change gst before the 3 years are up.I don’t remember seeing that at the time it was introduced, does any-one remember?
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This is the last thing we need when going into recession. This Government really needs to get a grip on its spending, just like the rest of us in times like these.
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The island is now firmly a place for the working class and for the 60k+ earners. I am a flat owner my neighbours are a nice couple with young children, is it fair they should live in a flat and a jobless pair shall raise kids in a brand new house on a minimal rental. I think not. I am lucky enough to earn my own home and I’m happy to pay taxes however not to support the life style of others. GST is merely a mop, the states departments run on far too high budgets, My equivalent job in the states sector would earn me 30% more with pension. I feel like I’m the absent father paying maintenance although its debatable if I am the father! Drive around a states estate with the new houses, i don’t see a clapped out nissan cherry!
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hi Dave (28) i am the same since Terry and his mates have lost the plot I have cut down and not spending like I used to in fact I now have more cash left over each month, so stuff the states, we have 2 prime examples of non-truths 1 Terry saying no rise for 3 years and Phillip saying I will look into delaying 20% so we know that what ever these 2 in the 2 top jobs say it does not mean anything….
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I would rather spend my money in France…at least when you need the goverment they at least help you out….a 2 inch cut in my hand whilst on holiday in St Malo I was in and out of a very clean efficent AnE dept all stiched up in less that an hour at a cost of 7 euros I cant wait to leave my native home land and live in France!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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The 2 Terrys should meet for a coffee & have a chat about how fewer J cats would affect GST. With fewer J Cats around you have fewer people paying tax. J Cats having essential employment should be welcomed rather than discouraged, to prevent the coming increase in GST. Fewer J Cats equals a shrinking tax base. The rumblings are already there for the increase to be in GST. It’s odd that on the Jersey web site it says, inter alia, “Jersey is also a diverse community that is home to people from all over the world…people who have chosen to live and work in the Island, and from whose skills and attributes, Jersey has benefited.” Maybe a change is in the air?
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How about you idiots stop spending money on useless things we don’t need?
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This is how the propaganda starts – they begin by putting out a few news items, laying the foundations for their plans and then over the next couple of years they expand on them until eventually the gullible members of the population believe what they’re saying is the truth. So in the same manner that they fooled so many into believing GST was the only viable alternative to replacing the exempt tax, they are now working on making us believe it has to go up if we are to survive. Do not be taken in by these people.
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I have lived in Jersey for 35 years now.
Brought up a family, kept out of debt, always paid my bills and taxes.
But I have never known Jersey to have such plonkers! in the states.
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suprise suprise!!!! NOT.
This has been so predictable from the start!!!
I really don’t get it, what do they need all this money for?? To build more irrelevent statues? To fix more roads that don’t need fixing and have to pay 15 mento watch 2 men do the job??!!
Come on look at where you are going wrong, that’ll save you massive amounts of money, without having to make everybody else suffer!!
The states need to start looking at their priorities and stop worrying about improving the island for tourist! How about you start looking after your own before putting everyone else first!!!!!!!!!!!
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Why don’t they build more nurseries so all children can start when they are suppose to and then single parents can go and earn a living and pay fair amounts of tax, Instead of them having to live off benefits (which states have to pay for) so they can take care of their children! Surely more people working equals more tax paid!!!
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i think we are all wasting our time posting on here or voicing our opinions TLS and all the other states members do what ever they want they have no thoughts or cares for the people of jersey any more! im a jersey been and would have loved to spend the rest of my life here but it’s looking pretty unlikely that will happen i can just about afford to live now, another 18 months i wont be able to so states memeber you keep doing/spending whatever you want give it a few more year and there will be no one left in this lovely island by the time the next election!
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Just to show how little faith I have in Terry Le Sueur – I want Frank Walker back!!!!
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Well considering GST was calculated when it was first run out and it was something more like 13% to 15% perhaps they should do it properly this time, how about reverse all prices back to where they were a year ago and only add 3% plus whatever else extra you’re planning to charge, most likely it will be less that what you are already ripping us off with.
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You people make me laugh. On the one hand people don’t want Jersey to be a ‘tax haven’, but then when it is put to the people of Jersey that the people of Jersey should pay for their own services there is uproar!
The article isn’t clear when GST is likely to rise. I thought the States promised not before 2011 (might be wrong). In any case these predictions were before the credit crunch and the potential for millions of tax receipts to be lost on revenue from falling company profits and savings and investments as the market crashes and interest rates reach zero. The potential hole has to be plugged some how – would you suggest illegal activity? Shall we invite more tax evaders? GST may be on target but that was a target set before the potential effects of the credit crunch.
As for the less well off – I’m sure income support will be adjusted to compensate meaning it will be the middle earners most affected… nothing new there. Those saying they refuse to spend here because of GST, especially when it is rather pathetic like dave (28) who walks further than necessary to save 3p, are only making matters worse.
I’m sure the States can cut costs and even jobs. Unfortunately that won’t solve anything and in fact may be more expensive as making people redundant will lead to even less tax receipts, less spend in the economy and an increase in handouts – not to mention a generous redundancy packages. You can tax the 1(1)k’s more but they will just leave further reducing tax receipts.
Any other ideas? Answers on a post card.
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How about we fall behind the UK, go ahead make GST into VAT, in fact we could save money by sacking all the idiotic states members entirely and follow UK law, at leat we’d have proper laws to follow
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Why don’t they start taxing the rich and introduce Capital Gains Tax like every other developed part of the world in order to generate taxes instead of widening the already absurd gap between rich and poor on the island? Could it be that most States members are rich themseleves and benefit from existing loopholes to reduce their tax burdens?
I have no issue with taxation as long as it’s effective and delivers a clear benefit to the population it serves. This does not include costly refurbishments every states public utility building, botching the former weightbridge area into a stark and cold concrete piazza, moving the tourism building to a ridiculous location (and then moving it back, building a multi million pound multi storey park and encouraging a culture of civil decay through mismanagement and a complete lack of coherent direction.
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Who is that tax going to hurt the most??
The people who are already struggling to survive…
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dave didn’t you know they look after the greedy not the needy? about time they got the rich to pay higher taxes it wouldn’t even make a dent in their pocket. sorry joker but i’m with dave(28) here i also get my mags from smiths,why should i pay spar when they charge separate prices for each mag/paper,and any other thing you buy.if gst had been at the till instead of on every article these shops would have to stop their proffitering,maybe i too am pathetic.i have worked hard all my life,so why should i give these greedy retailers extra money on top of gst
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We are seeing the effects of unrestrained growth in our financial admin industry. A serious collapse in the social cohesion we used to have as incomes polarize. If we hadn’t deliberately chosen to have gone down the route of low tax structures for overseas business, we wouldn’t have to have moved to the 0% & 10% tax for corporates and hence no need to force up taxes on individuals, GST etc. Whereas previously someone on modest means in Jersey could still feel they participated in island life, now they are paupered and effectively excluded. An island for corporate lawyers, principals of administration firms, Jersey landowners and 1.1k tax exiles.
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What I’d like to know is why items in France are less expensive than in Jersey despite including a VAT of 19.5%?
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I agree D Le Geyt (30)…perhaps a Coup is in order to usurp the idiots in charge….they are clearly abusing their positions which are to serve the public! Anarchy I say lets rebel and overthrow these despots!!!
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So is Jersey void from the recession now Terry as you stated?!? Ill informed or ignorant?!? 20/20 tax, higher cost of living than the UK and Europe and now raising a tax that was only recently brought in against public opinion. Colleagues and friends are now all saying that anymore and it will certainly be time to turn off the lights and leave the island. Its become to difficult to maintain a reasonable standard of living…
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Nathan (56), Dave and Moi (30 & 57) have the answer. The French just will not put up with being ripped off. They make their feelings clearly known with actions and not just words. The only way we will ever change things is to take to the streets.
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The only way we will change anything is by voting for decent people in the first place.
On the Greffe website you can see the voting record of every States Member – well worth keeping an eye on and reviewing come the next elections!
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48 Paul – Just how was Frank any better than Terry, since he took Terry’s advice on how to squeeze more tax out of us anyway?
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Shocking, if true. Jersey has been sold down the river.
How can Terry expect islanders to manage to pay taxation at UK levels and property prices at central London levels?
Cut back on spending like everyone else, or just run the island into the ground.
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Cheif Minister to go at next election….well I for one will not be voting for him!
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If he wants to raise more taxes why isn’t he doing anything about catching the tax dodgers, the ones who are paid cash in hand. The cleaners on £10/11 per hour working 10/12 hours a day 7 days a week. The gardeners’ on £14/15 working the same or even longer hour all cash in had. Work it out! It is morally wrong that we should be expected to pay more tax when they not only get away it, but probably claim income support as well. I agree with some of the other comments on the rent rebate system it was brought in to help the lower paid not make the landlords richer. I have heard people bragging about how they always send their rent rebate to their bank account back home, how do they qualify to receive it if they can afford to do that. You don’t need to catch them, just make the penalty so high that it would put them off in the first place. Put regular adverts in the JEP and also on Channel News warning people. It is immoral that old age pensioner have to struggle when these people are making a fortune by ripping of the taxman. But no knows this bunch by the time they have hired dozens of consultants to discuss it, hired dozens of J Cats to implement it, it would end up being a loss anyway
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Nellie, at least with Frank Walker we knew he was going to “shaft” us! With TLS (and his COM)he is so prone to changing what he says from one day to the next we don’t know where we stand.
FW was decisive in what he said and did, (though I didn’t agree with him on much he stood for), TLS is the most indecisive Politician Jersey has ever had. That just leads to more turmoil as people have no idea of the direction (if any) he wants to steer the Island towards!!!
Give me decisiveness over flip-flopping any day of the week – please!!!
And yes I did my bit by voting for “opposition” States members at the last elections. I just hope all the people on here who are complaining voted (and hopefully against the status quo if they don’t agree with the way the Island is being run by the COM). We all knew what the present COM would be like if they got back in; and I’m sorry to say they are proving all “opposition” candidates and supporters right. They didn’t listen to the 19000 who said No to GST; but I’m sure if those 19000 had voted against the encumbants we would not be discussing the potential raising of GST because it would already have been revoked.
They say you get the Government the people vote for; unfortunately we didn’t because the biggest vote getter was “None of the above”
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Would Philip Ozouf and Alan Mclean have been re elected if they had stated at the recent hustings that they would be likely to raise GST to above 3%, would they have been elected if they had been honest and informed the public that Jersey was unlikely to be immune from the predicted global recession, rather than insisting that we were well placed to ride it out?
The electorate seem to be so easily duped by silver tongued promises and look where that is getting us. Wishing it doesn’t make it so. Jersey citizens have allowed themselves to become completely dis-empowered.
Time to take back some control and let the politicians, who after all are supposed to represent us and work on our behalf, know how we feel.
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Sen. le Suer only got 9976 votes in the 2008 election, and Mr. Walker only got 9377 votes in 2002. 19000 people signed the petition against GST, thats a lot more people than voted them in. Yet, they still dismissed the petition and carried on regardless. So, is it really that surprising? Clearly, their elections results show that they don’t represent the majority of the Jersey population.
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Michaelis (no 64)Thank you for pointing out the “tax dodgers” such as (some) cleaners which is something I recently stumbled upon whilst trying to organise a cleaner for a relative in Jersey.There must be hundreds (perhaps thousands?) of such people making a good living and not contributing a penny to local taxes yet good old Joe Bloggs struggles on doing everything legally and correct and getting a kick in the teeth for his trouble-great isn’t it!
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Bean abroad
In no way are Jersey’s tax levels the same as the UK’s. In fact Jersey’s personal tax rates are still amongst the lowest in the world even with 20/20 and GST.
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Michaelis
Totally agree with you. Unfortunately it would probably require more civil sevants… can’t do that when the public demand a cut back. They’ll just have to continue to get away with it.
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blah blah blah
11,000 people signed a petition for a town park including a car park. 10 years later 2,000 people signed another petition for ditching both.
Petitions mean nothing other than people venting ‘not in my back yard’ winging.
You still have the ability to influence the Chief Minister position by voting Ministers and Deputies who should declare their preference… unfortunately most declined to do so.
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It is fair to point out that candidates were repeatedly asked who they would support as Chief Minister.
Very few were prepared to state that they intended to support Terry le Sueur but a large majority voted for him in the secret ballot.
It is time for Jersey politicians to put honesty before what is naked opportunism and vote catching!
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And so the fiasco begins again… and the worst of it is that people genuinely believe they didn’t see it coming!
In answer to a couple of points written here, the answer is yes. There is evidence that GST will be raised before the 3 year “grace period” it was originally given. These details are available for everyone to find, although very difficult.
During the Senatorial husting (yes, it is I, Mr. Last Place) I pointed out to anybody who would listen that there is a clause in the agreement for GST that allows it to be raised before the 3 years are up if any amendments are made to the original plan. This would, wait for it, include removing GST from food – which people were all happy to see happen without realising what this would allow Mr Le Sueur to do.
So none of us can complain about this. It is all there in black and white to see. Islanders should have used their voice during the elections to change the States majority (and I don’t mean me – my campaign was solely a soap box for me!). Admittedly, we have a poor offering for opposition. Short of Alan Breckon I struggle to see anyone with the ability or desire to place themselves in the firing line to change anything.
Please look at the states website. You’ll surprise yourself with the worse things that are on their way!!
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Joker,
Don’t believe the guff put out by our political masters when they tried to justify the introduction of GST. For the lower paid, Jersey has some of the highest income tax rates in Europe – eg in France , the lower paid will pay one month’s salary, after allowances – that’s about 8%. It is only when you move up the scale, where other jurisdictions use bandings, that the tax rates increase.
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72 Pip Clement – the non-establishment newbies all stated who they were going to vote for and we counted how many votes we thought could be relied on – the number was exacly as predicted so you can be confident that they did not vote for TLS.
They would have preferred an open ballot by the way.
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Nellie, I did the same sums and came out within a few of the eventual totals.
I am trying to point out as gently as possible that quite a few long standing States’ members came over all even handed, man of the people for the duration of the campaign.
Now they are safely back in office thay have retreated back to their entrenched positions as good reliable votes for Terry le Sueur come thick or thin.
The connection betwen what you vote for and what you get is very tenuous in Jersey
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Gary
Tell me of another western country that gives single person thresholds of £12k before you’re even charged a penny of personal tax. Even once you’re above the threshold you still may only pay a few percent depending on your situation. Compare that to the 10%, 30% and 40% bands of the UK – one of the lowest taxing countries in the world. I also don’t see anyone here paying 11% social security or 15.5% VAT either.
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Joker,
You’re using a bit of spin here!
To recieve the allowance of £12,040 you will be charged the rest at 27%.
The normal single person’s allowance is £3,600 (about Euros 4,200) when tax is charged at 20%.
For your information here are a few personal allowance figures in other European countries: -
Austria – Euros 10,000
Belgium – Euros 7,200
Finland – Euros 12,000
The first bandings are then usually 20% or lower.
I could go on and add a lot more.
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I wonder how many of the above complainants voted for candidates who supported the introduction of GST in the first place.
We voted them in and now we have to live with that decision. It’s our own stupid fault.
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I think TLS has just woken up to how much revenue he has lost in trying to force the smokers to pack it in.
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