1

the future

The bit I like

“They are also reviewing the role of the Justice Ministry”

Yes lets do that please.

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3

Nick

What we are not being told here is that the Ministry of Justice is a New Labour (Republican) vehicle for eliminating the Queen in Privy Council to whom the Island related before.
The Ministry of Justice currently has Jack Straw at it’s head and is not an all party body like the Privy Council but a Government Department that New Labour have created to replace the Lord Chancellor’s function in the House of Lords!
It is all part of this back door deal that has led to the creation of a UK Supreme Court to take over the legal function previously exercised by the House of Lords.
The New Supreme Court is a direct copy of the American one, and in case everyone has forgotten, the USA is a Republic!
We are one step away from President Brown as Head of State and not one voter either here or in the UK has been consulted!
The “Crown Dependencies” now relate to the Ministry of Justice which is under the control of one person, the Secretary of State for Justice who is a political appointee by the Party in Government in the UK not a Crown appointee as was the case with the Privy Council, which also contained a body of Crown appointees from all Parties.
If our local Ministers can’t see the flaw in this arrangement then what are they in politics for? Good relationship or bad this is an attempt to impose one party rule from Westminster through the back door without the electorate here and there even being consulted!
And in the case of the electorate here without our even having the means to vote!
If anyone sees an error in this viewpoint maybe they would care to correct me, I am open to persuasion and hopeful I am wrong?

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5

richard from the uk

I live in England and this topic has not been on the UK news at all. I know that the UK government dose not meat till October next so how is this being done by the government. Also the lib deb who are not in power. So why can’t my government keep their nose out of where it should be and if it not broke why try to fix it.

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7

Boris

Nick, what a load of twaddle! Your understanding of the constitutional standing of the courts v the executive v the queen in parliament beggars belief and is more mixed up than a very mixed up thing! The constitutional position of the House of Lords was a tad anomalous to say the least. As a court of final appeal it is or was technically subordinate to the Court of Appeal even though one does appeal from the Court of Appeal to the House of Lords, who incidentally sat in lounge suits and not judicial garb.
It was also the case that any member of the House of Lords was entitled to sit in on appeals to the House of Lords and not just the appointed judges who were also members of the House of Lords. However the last time this happened was sometime in the 19th Century and he was ignored by the judges present.

Ergo it makes perfect sense to regularise the situation, call a shovel a duck and create a ‘Supreme Court’ which actually does what it says on the tin.

How far this goes in creating a Republic or a Stalinist Utopia or a Neo Nazi Jersey is anyone’s guess.

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9

Nick

5. Richard from the UK, you may be surprised to know that this Court actually starts work in October this year.An Act of Parliament in 2005 created it and it comprises I believe 9 judges who are “Appointed” members of the House of Lords, although I am not sure who they are “Appointed” by, but suspect it is the UK Government of the day?
The Act of Parliament creating this was not much reported on at the time and I suspect on investigation it was pushed through by use of the majority vote in the House of Commons enjoyed by the current UK Government, although on this issue I don’t think any of the main UK Political Parties can be fully trusted.
They have spent quite a bit of public money revamping a Court Room (I forget the location)for the purpose.
All this has come about as a result of the Constitutional Reform Act which has not really been focused on by the British (Specifically English)electorate with regard to it’s implications.
Perhaps you should consult your local MP and the various Internet sources on this subject?
I make the English electorate a special case above as Scotland has it’s own set up, as will N.Ireland and Wales.
As far as I’m aware Jersey still has the Judicial Council of the Privy council as it’s ultimate Court of Appeal, as do Guernsey and the Isle of Man (The three Crown Dependencies)
We three even differ individually in our Constitutional relationships with the UK and as such are quite unique.We also have a unique relationship with the EEC as a result.

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11

Nick

John: I am not advocating Monarchy recovering it’s “Absolute rule” powers as in the days of Henry V111. I am saying that the status of the Queen as an apolitical non executive Head of State is important because anyone who tries to acquire that position cannot do so by anything other than illegal means,i.e. by force.
It is therefore apparent to other Nations should that happen that anyone aspiring to or acquiring such status in the UK is not in fact legitimate.
Obviously if the UK and Jersey electorate were to vote overwhelmingly for a Republic then that would be a different matter, but are you that attracted to such a system where if you place political executive power in a President (An individual whose personal qualities and aspirations are largely unknown to the majority electing him or her) as Head of State he or she merely becomes another Henry V111 type figure wielding absolute power.
You grandly state most of the world’s democracies are Republics,but then how many so called Republics are actually currently sustaining or have in the recent past sustained tyrant dictators?
You are wholly wrong in saying the Monarchy is not central to these Islands, the whole financial success of Jersey is based on relative political stability and a legal system sustained by the UK Constitutional Monarchy system of Government.
The whole attraction worldwide is that of longevity,in built flexibility,and the security of knowing that the underlying infrastructure of the Nation is not going to collapse overnight if someone shoots your Head of State or your Chief Executive(The Prime Minister), or even both of them at once!And the ongoing satisfaction of knowing exactly who will succeed to the Head of State role as they have lived their whole life under public scrutiny and censure since birth.
And a Monarchy based on a family structure is understood worldwide as a foundation for living principal.
As for “not contributing to our society”, that comment is so ill-informed and fatuous that I find it hard to believe you can have resided on this planet? The current Monarch has maintained worldwide and important social connections throughout the Globe with countries which under your Republican system would just be ignored as ineffectual and unimportant, also in our relations with new nations with considerable financial clout she has been instrumental in highlighting the social connection rather than just the material wealth aspiration.No one competes with her on any level because they just plain can’t,and the fact that we are prepared to send someone so important to even the smallest country is the highest compliment we as a Nation can make.
I wish you could have seen Prince Charles greeting all the Arab Heads of State to a dinner on the Royal Yacht when it was moored in Dubai Creek in the 1980′s. These were men who could have, and indeed did possess Yachts far more modern and much grander, but who queued up to go up the gang plank of “that” yacht because the significance and the compliment being paid to them by the UK as a Nation was not lost on them. And the Princes Trust is on record statistically as having been responsible for the successful venture funding of more new businesses than practically any other institution.
And despite appearances Jersey would not have flourished as much as it has if it had been as “Conservative” with a capital “C” as you claim. If you want that you should have gone to the Isle of Wight which has only recently caught on to how to maximize it’s potential having demonstrated stifling conservatism for decades!
And as for Jersey’s “Lefties” if they concentrated on winning the electorate over by making some positive contribution to Island government instead of rabble rousing and seeking political change as a matter of dogmatic principal whether it is in fact change for the better or not, perhaps they would fair better!The problem they now have is convincing the electorate at large that a leopard can change it’s spots!

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13

John

Well John I’ll take the points in your posting at 12 in the paragraph order you have raised them:-
1)A powerless Head of State in a Republic? the whole true Republican concept is based on having a political appointee who has executive powers!
You name Ireland as an example and say why can’t the UK copy them, to which I respond why on earth would you or the electorate of the UK wish to do that?
Stop someone in the Street anywhere in the World and ask them who the current “Taoiseach” is and they will be hard pressed to understand what you are talking about let alone name who is the present incumbent of that office, or what her background or personal views are? (Although she is in fact an admirable person for which fact the Irish should thank their lucky stars)
Then ask the same question about our current Monarch, who in quite a few of those countries is also their Head of State?
Better still go to some of the smaller islands in Pacific Micronesia and ask the same questions.
As for the idea that people just wouldn’t accept one person seizing power,well that’s as maybe, but if you have already made him/her head of the Army/Navy and Air Force and provided an entourage with personal protection equipment such as those available to President Obama, you have given that individual a rather large stick to beat you with as you try to take it away from them! If there weren’t so many examples of whole countries being seized in this fashion I might be persuaded that your woolly alternative of the people gathering in the street to “Protest” was a sufficient safeguard! Perhaps you should tell that to Iranian citizens who tried that recently?
As for me “Fearmongering”, I think that is a little rich when back door Republicans never miss an opportunity to “Character Assassinate” one Royal or another for any slight misdemeanor or human failing!
And what about the constant implication that the powerless Monarch as UK Head of State is somehow manipulating herself into a political return to “Absolute Rule”?
And the constantly used tactic in covering up some Government cock up by implying Royal responsibility, or dangling a juicy but irrelevant and often imagined misdemeanor by some minor Royal (But more often the Heir Apparent) in front of the World Media?

2)As for the hypothetical Arab Heads of State snubbing Prince Charles i.f.o. the President of the US? well Charles is only a Head of State in waiting so you could be right, but I think you underestimate the character and integrity of the Arab Heads of State, who have absolutely no reason to be in awe of a Country solely ruled by the doctrine of acquiring material assets and personal wealth!
And I think you would find your situation would be far closer run if we were talking about the Queen herself, after all she can always top any materialism by showing them her collection of original MichaelAngelo’s or some other little trinket and probably entertain them more by knowing the background and history of the artist and the object itself!
Perhaps you might recall the 50th Anniversary celebrations of the D day landings and the way the World’s media more or less ignored the entire US Sixth Fleet at anchor off Portsmouth to show US President Clinton and HRH studying a map on the deck of the Royal Yacht on their way to France.
An accidental upstaging about which incidentally President Clinton was most gracious, which fact won him considerable personal respect with the citizens of the WW2 Allied Nations, as nothing could have been more natural than him sharing such a moment with someone who was a contemporary of the event in question.
Not quite the case with President Mitterand who suffered the same when the Royal Yacht arrived in France and he became aware that HRH had brought her own catering!
No wonder the current French President suffered a sudden loss of memory when issuing invitations for the recent celebrations!
As for Prince Harry as Head of State with no executive or political power, I would far rather that than President Blair, Brown, Martin,Cameron,Tarbuck or even Uncle Tom Cobbly or some appointee about whom I would probably know little when asked to vote them into power!

3)I cannot agree that “Lefties” have not been given a chance internationally, after all whatever was the USSR all about if that was the case?
Locally? perhaps it’s a case of the electorate not wishing to place their necks under the guillotine blade just to see if it still works?
As for my being unfair, I am actually in agreement that local politics does need more motivation from people such as Deputy Southern, and if you want proof of that read my posting on his recent Town Park proposal. However as for the introduction (Or is it revival)of local Party politics based on political dogma,Deputy Southern’s actions since being voted in perhaps demonstrate the local electorate’s reluctance to buy into this. For instance, how many of his Party’s Manifesto Proposals has he actively pursued, as against indulging in petty attacks on the “Establishment”? If that’s not time and money wasting, chip on the shoulder,dogmatic behaviour I don’t know what is!
My purpose in raising this issue is highlighted by posting 5.Richard in the UK, who as a UK voter is wholly unaware apparently that the administrative infrastructure for a republican system of government is being put in place in the UK at his expense as a UK taxpayer, and as a UK voter, without consultation or agreement that he is aware of!
Maybe now he will ask a few questions of his elected representative?

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15

Bean

Nick & John, the blogs are for comments & views, not a platform for who ate the biggest part of a dictionary for dinner, swap phone numbers or something or even consider getting married, its a lot of dribble about nothing and getting a bit boring.

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