Suicides: 60% more than UK
Friday 16th October 2009, 3:00PM BST.
Medical Officer of Health Dr Rosemary Geller
SUICIDE rates in Jersey are more than 60 per cent higher than in England, worrying new figures have revealed.
The number of Islanders taking their own lives has increased steadily since 2005 – with a sharp rise in suicides last year. Sixteen Islanders committed suicide last year, compared to a previous average of about ten.
Mental health services are now being reviewed and improved and a major programme to help health professionals detect and treat those with psychological problems is being rolled out.
Dr Rosemary Geller, Jersey’s Medical Officer of Health, said: ‘The number of suicides has been increasing over recent years and we saw a big rise in 2008. We are now studying the figures closely and examining what needs to be done to bring down the number of Islanders committing suicide.’
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Like all statistics this figure could be massively misleading. For example if you were to compare Jersey with any town in the UK of similiar size would the figure still stand?
Sad nonetheless and anything they can do to reduce the figure is a positive step.Some will cite non quals living conditions, drink & drugs as the root cause but I think it’s representative of modern living.We don’t have community in the way that we did and neighbours are virtually strangers.
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Well take a bow boys and girls that really epitomises SUCCESS doesn’t it….the blatant push of avarice and greed by the money grabbing mongrels here has really sponsored this stuff…PEOPLE used to matter here, the community spirit has been steadily watered down by the politics of wanton materialism at any price,destroy the peoples totems and they lose heart…till the worm turns…we have set ourselves up for two generations of “The world owes me a living” thinking.which will take many tears to turn round,the mental health implications of the Affluenza that afflicts those whose foolish parents have allowed them £100 shoes ,mobile phones,have paid off their credit cards when they can’t even hold down a simple job is beginning to really bite…a forgetting of old values like fair play,honesty,integrity,and stickability…all gone…and who taught them..?the so called leaders who still treat the population with contempt. so who is there for them to look up to ,admire,or want to emulate,can you think of any of our so called leaders that you want your kid to become like..?Leadership takes courage,strength,and a willingness to do the right thing whatever the personal cost…Oh Dear is the bar too high.when Ghandi died,everything he owned fitted into one shoebox..he will be remembered forever…what was your name again senator………….?
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Unfortunately health and social security fail to identify relevant issues which need to be addressed. Firstly Alcohol and Drug addiction is poorly funded and unfortunately even more poorly managed – the majority of suicides occur in people with alcohol or drug problems. Secondly the way family doctors are paid (i.e. from fees charged rather than direct from government (taxes) – makes it difficult for patients who really need to see the doctor to be able to afford it (people who carry the burden of most illness have the least income – “the inverse care law”). Both of these provide a barrier for vulnerable people accessing the help they need.
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Jersey: Life Enriching ?
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Dr Rosemary Geller, Jersey’s Medical Officer of Health… Jersey’s official scare-monger more like. First swine-flu scare-mongering and now suicide.
16 out of 100,000 odd. Which is 60% more than the UK… So the UK has a 10 in 100,000 average does it. Sure.
16, i’m thinking, is that all?
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Umm.. maybe the number has gone up due to there being more people on the Island!?
If population numbers go up does that not mean that other statistics are likely to rise?!
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An aquaintance who had worked in Jersey for 12 years warned me about coming here because of what he called the Jersey “Peasant mentality”. When asked to explain that he said it was the combination of narrow-mindedness (socially regressive and suspicious of change) and avarice, ie a very unhealthy obsession with gaining and hoarding wealth. I think he was right and those features combined with the degrading housing conditions that a lot of people have to live in , can make it a very depressing place to live if you are not one of the winners over here.
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Jersey is a depressing place to live….nothing to do…and tiny flats etc etc….thats exactly why left 5 years ago…seems nothing has changed
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Well Yosser you have probably hit the nail on the head.
Drink and drugs are not the main cause for suicide that is just shirking responsibility and having the ignorant Jersey mentality that contributes to peoples stress and mental health.. most ex heroin addicts I know of are looked after better than normal hardworking people who struggle to make ends meet.
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Does anyone know how adequate Jersey’s treatment is for addictions & mental health issues?
I’ve recently read articles about alcohol abuse in Jersey, and now worrying statistics on suicide. Perhaps the States need to address these issues by seeing if GPs need help or training to identify symptoms
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Thicko Micko (1)
I think you are quite right in saying its the modern way of life and lack of community spirit. One used to walk or cycle to the corner shop saying hi to a few people on the way (not stuck in a car) then have a chat with the shop keeper who they would almost certainly know. Now one is lucky if the shop keeper speaks good english.
The pace of life has picked up so much that friendlieness has gone and Jersey has to be one of the places with the most modern way of life around proving that all this growth and rushing around does not make people happy, it just makes people money, and money does not equal happieness.
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The headline says ‘UK’ and the 1st paragraph says ‘England’. Which is it? There’s about a 10 million person difference between the two. Sloppy journalism.
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Hmmmm…is it statistically significant? No mention of any post-hoc stats testing…
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I was reading the Euronews today, and apparently 25 employees of France Télécom, have taken their own lives in the past 18 months.
The latest victim was just yesterday (a 48-year-old engineer with a wife and family). Many of the victims blamed their final tragic act on highly-stressful work conditions.
The company, which employs about 100,000 people (slightly more than the population of Jersey), recently started to reduce and reshuffle its workforce which brought pressure and fear into the workplace…and obviously, for the less resilient, this fear turned to torment…
So maybe instead of handing out tea, pills and sympathy someone should take a long look at current management-practices.
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Aside from the statistical significance questions raised is it not relevant that we have been in the grip of the worst recession since the great depression? – with major unemployment like we haven’t seen in Jersey for a long time. I suspect that this accounts for some element of the rise.
Inquests have historically been careful about registering suicides over misadventure – a slight change in policy (perhaps a new incumbent presiding over inquest proceedings) could easily explain this move as well.
Sorry I’m not convinced by what health have to say on the subject and I’m certainly not prepared to dismiss Jersey as hell on earth like many commentators seem to be doing!
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@ truthseeker #2
You appear to be saying that the predominant reason for a person to commit suicide is financial. While I don’t disagree that difficult financial situations can add to the troubles a person who considers suicide may have I think it’s very rare that it would be the only consideration.
For some people the decision to end their lives is simply because they’ve thought about it, and not being alive is a better prospect than being alive in the way they live. Money does not make you happy, but it does allow you to make changes to your situation more easily.
Say somebody was desperately unhappy because they lived in Jersey, with no friends, no family, and a poor quality of life, while knowing that there was a place where they could have all these things, yet their finances don’t allow them to buy a ticket to go there: so trapped here miserable they decide to take their own life.
What would your view be? they were too greedy in wanting enough money to buy the ticket?
Everything I own could fit in a shoe box, do you think that makes happy and content with my life?
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Jersey also is one of the highest users of anti-depressants per capita in the world
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#14 Unfortunately they are right in saying that given the number of employees they have it is statistically normal but I do believe they should be more concerned than they seem to be.
Mentall illness is a difficult subject and it is something that the non-mentally ill cannot and will not understand (even the professionals).
Oddly enough it is far less scary when you consider what is happening in the brain. Although mental illness is indeed ‘all in the head’, that doesn’t stop it being a physical problem. Some mental illnesses are considered to have the same physical cause as epilepsy, just in a different part of the brain. In very simple terms a short circuit which in one part of the brain causes seizures but in another causes hallucinations. Many mentally ill people take anti-epileptic drugs.
Mentally ill people need to know that their symptoms are actually very common, they can occur in non-mentally ill people at any time for any number of reasons, just that in the mentally ill there is a permanent cause making them regular occurences. After all, the brain is very complex, and with the number of electrical pulses that fire around the brain and body it’s not surprising that they sometimes take a ‘wrong turn’.
It is not a ‘bad life’ that causes you to take your own life, it is your own mind. It is not family, friends or work, it is your own mind. It is not an ‘easy way out’ or a ‘selfish act’ because at the time you consider it these considerations are completely irrelevant. Society needs to comprehend that for the mentally ill their OWN head can be a very scary place, and it is a scary place that they foresee becoming even scarier over time… unfortunately without successful medication there is only one way to get out of that scary place!
If a loved one takes their own life, do not blame yourself. Terrible things happen to people all the time that don’t result in the person committing suicide. If you know a family who have lost someone to suicide then don’t be afraid to help them as you would had they lost the person in some other way. It is not their fault, but, they will be in the unfortunate position of never getting answers, because they couldn’t be inside their loved one’s head.
Statistically a mentally ill person is LESS of a threat to you than someone who is not mentally ill. This is a fact. They are more of a threat to themselves, not others. Maybe if people could get this into their heads they would stop being so afraid of mental illness and start being more considerate to those who are simply different to themself!
Of course, a mentally ill person can be provoked, can be jealous, can get angry, and can react violently given the same circumstances that a non-mentally ill person would. But the media is too quick to jump on the mental illnes!
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Truthseeker 2.
Many of the things you say ring true.
However, I do not think that money is the root of all evil. Rather, the “obsession” with money is the root of unhappiness.
In my opinion, people who take their own lives do so simply because physical existence has become unbearable for them.
It’s almost impossible for someone like me (I’ve never had a day’s depression in my life) to understand the reasons behind such a tragic act. But, I truly believe that the demands of an exacting boss/workplace/family are capable of doing far more damage to a vulnerable mind than financial difficulty.
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Born Warrior, it is not money that is said to be the root of evil, it is the love of money. And boy does Jersey love its money! Even the island slogan – ‘Life enriching’ – has the word rich in it. Jersey and Guernsey remind me of Sodom and Gomorrah, and by going bust they are about to get the fall that they’ve had coming for a long time now. It will take away their pride and bring much needed humility. Painful? Yes. Essential? Surely.
Only a ‘Road to Damascus’ experience brought about by ruin will save us all from the moral bankruptcy that we have been heading towards for several decades.
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Thanks to those who have actually noted that one of the main factors of mental stress is contributed by mismanagement and poor working conditions.. have experience of that myself and it is not nice.. its even more annoying that the culprits do not seem to ever suffer the consequences of their bullying and are allowed to continue treating people the way they do its disgusting. In my case my replacement at work is experiencing the same problem with the same person and someone close to me is experiencing it on a major scale at present, ironically so other people have also had the same problems with the individuals causing the stress lies and underhand tactics in order to preserve their own jobs UNACCEPTABLE Well done also to JACS for the last two features in the JEP about these issues aswell..
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Populations need respectable leadership..yet we still have Jim Perchard employed by us ..a man who openly told a Senator who has been under extreme pressure to “Go and Top himself”what message is that to people especially young impressionable people….how does this man have the neck to stay ..it shows a callous disregard and contempt for the voters….
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This is not new, I spoke to a States Member about this some time ago.
Jersey attracts people with problems, they come here to get away from failed marriages and from areas where they are ‘known’ to the police.
I have also met men who came here to get away form the CSA so they do not have to pay for their children in the UK.
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@ truthseeker #22
While I totally agree that Sen. Perchard, in respect to the incident you refer to, should have stood down/been expelled from office, I don’t think that comments like that send any specific message regarding suicide to the people who might consider it.
From my POV people who consider suicide do so for a whole host of reasons personal to them, and rarely a single reason; nobody’s going to take a comment like Perchard’s as personal except he to which it was directed. Of course if Perchard should go then Syvret should go too, he’s showing far greater contempt of voters with his actions.
@Leah Holmes #18
While I don’t disagree that those with mental illness are susceptible to suicide, I don’t think suicide in itself is an indication or mental illness; some people who consider suicide are perfectly rational, and consider it as a perfectly reasonable option.
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@ J Lamborrai #24
Re Perchard, the man apologized, learnt his lesson and I was happy for thim to stay in post.
Re everything else in your post. I absolutely agree. Very good post.
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” I don’t think suicide in itself is an indication or mental illness; some people who consider suicide are perfectly rational, and consider it as a perfectly reasonable option.
”
Yes, that’s right. The voice of reason and factual psychiatric analysis.
Well done!
Can you show me where this statement is backed up with scientific study?
It’s no wonder the state of mental health care in these fascist islands is conveniently brushed away with this as ‘an excellent post’.
In all my years I have never heard suicide described as ‘rational’.
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I find it interesting that people are blaming the success of some for others suicides and is really a display of how some people cannot stand other people doing well for themselves. We have comments like “if you’re not a winner here” or blaming someone’s “unhealthy obsession with gaining and hoarding wealth” eh?
What you’re effectively saying is 1(1)k residents are to blame, finance is to blame, and peoples self motivation to want to succeed financially is to blame. How on earth do the two correlate in any way? Suicide is a personal decision often correlated to one’s genetic mental health and not their environment. Jersey is hardly a slum and those using the success of others, or Jersey is a ‘hole’, as basis argument for suicide rates because they fundamentally disagree with how this place is run, does business, or has allowed some to become financially well off is disgusting.
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The sharp rise in suicides last year could be something to do with the haut de la garenne enquiry. Both victims and the abusers would be affected by past events being brought out into the open.
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In my honest opinion things are reaching crisis point in Jersey and have been for quite some time. Now have the government and those in charge the intelligence to work out what is wrong, or are they so stuck up their own back***** that they can’t figure it out?
joker there is a big disparity between the rich and poor in Jersey. Things like GST have only made matters worse. Prices are going through the roof for everything and yet we are in a recession. The standard of living for the majority is falling. However certain groups are cushioned from this, aren’t they?
Yes genetics plays a part in mental health but everyone has their breaking point. All you have to do is crank up the pressure enough and people will break. Where does pressure come from? Everywhere.
However it is nearly always pressure(stress) from work, family or finances that will crack people. Work and finances are closely connected.
Where do you think most pressures come from today? Yep you’ve got it, WORK. Which of the following do people suffer from?
long hours,
boring work,
insecurity,
bad boss syndrome,
work place bullying,
no sickness pay,
minimum wage,
holidays allocated to you by the boss as only one is allowed off at any one time,
half the mandatory annual by law as allowed in the UK.
And as we well know finding another job is becoming very hard now isn’t it?
How many suffer from at least some of the pressures above? How many are really unlucky and have a full house?
In today’s world work is getting more and more stressfull, is it any wonder that mental illness affects one in four now?
Now let us add the icing the cake of the demographic time bomb and pensions problems. How do you think people are going to take it when they are told sorry mate but YOU ARE going to work three years longer? No ifs, buts, or maybes.
Do you think any people at the end of their tether will be pleased by this or not? What is this likely to do to their stress levels, and do you think more people will decide to switch off and tune out? How many more will turn to drink, or drugs, or crime to try and alleviate their work and financial problems?
How many will take their work home with them causing them problems at home?
Finally yes I blame this culture of greed and service to self, which is now rife in Jersey, for many of the problems over here.
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@ Arnald #26
“…Can you show me where this statement is backed up with scientific study?…”
No, I’m afraid I’m unaware of *my* thoughts and or opinions forming the basis of any such study.
“…In all my years I have never heard suicide described as ‘rational’…”
I glad you’re are at least willing to accept that your post is based on your own limited experience, and I’m glad that now you’ve heard me say it you’ve further experiences to consider.
Would you care to show the scientific studies that disprove my opinion? Or even give some further insight as to why you seem to think it’s not possible that a rational person could make the decision to end their life.
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25 Big Bean
How do you know he learnt his lesson? Because he said so??
He deserved to get the sack….if I said those same words to a colleague at work I certainly would be shown the door so why not someone who is supposed to represent the population?
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Arnald
This is a very sensitive subject and peoples views will differ. It is important however that we do not judge and I don’t think it unreasonable to request that when entering correspondence on this subject with someone, that a little respect is used. Especially when you do not know anything about the person who’s post you have just dismissed so crudely.
Perhaps you are very fortunate not to have been close to someone who, for example has suffered with MND. There are other conditions too, where, a person may choose to die with dignity, rather than face years of pain with a very poor quality of life.
So, whilst accepting that suicide can often be the action taken by someone sufffering with a mental illness, in some cases the action of suicide has been a rational decision taking many factors and choices into consideration. You are very lucky not to have known or been close to someone where that difficult decision has been made.
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As someone who has periodically suffered from clinical depression and has very seriously considered suicide on more than one occasion, can I cast doubts on the value of most of the speculation on here. Depression is an illness – it is totally irrational and unpredictable and is like a form of possession. You find yourself unable to control your own thoughts and all the time you are dragged, as if by some gravitational force – to thoughts of topping yourself. Once it passes you think – what was that about? – but while it is there it controls you.
In my experience, the only way to alleviate depression is through change. As much change as possible. A new life in a new place always helps. And by definition, that is hard to achieve in jersey because it is an Island, and wherever you go, you see the same sights, the same faces. So you would expect the rate of suicides to be higher because the ability to change your environment is reduced.
Also, as people have commented, there are lots of drugs in Jersey, largely because the pro-crime/anti-drugs (same thing) policy of the States of Jersey mean that it is always financially irresistible for UK drug barons to target the Island. And drugs and involvement with criminals all tend to lead to problems.
Jersey is very materialistic and that isn’t healthy, but it’s not the main cause or even a factor.
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People with depression sometimes suffer with low self-esteem. Jersey clearly doesn’t help with this. We have a class system in Jersey, so people like me with quallies, can belittle those who don’t. Having no quallies in Jersey is akin to having leprosy. I can imagine the future would seem very bleak if you lived in a damp bedsit with absolutely no hope of changing this for a considerable period of time
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@mad foetus #33
“…Depression is an illness – it is totally irrational and unpredictable…”
I don’t disagree, but depression can also be something other than illness; it can just be the result of circumstance.
If somebody is clinically depressed (as in the illness) then it might be irrational and unpredictable, it might also respond to drug therapies; but if somebody is simply depressed through circumstance than that is perfectly rational and predictable. If you’re depressed because of financial debt, or through a loneliness then it’s rational; if you don’t have any realistic prospect of any change to your circumstances than thinking about an alternative to living unhappily is perfectly rational.
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Joker, you are right in that Jersey does not have slums of the absolute poverty variety. However, if you read the likes of Oliver James, it is apparently relative dispersion in wealth/status that can lead to issues of mental illness/unhapiness in modern societies. Those differences can actually be quite starck and obvious in Jersey even though we have a very high “average” income over here compared to anywhere in the industrialised world let alone other countries. I would love to see the States of Jersey publish the Gini statistics of wealth/income distribution which are an accepted measure of wealth distribution but I think I will be waiting a long time for something like that. Perhaps it might upset the apple cart.
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Big Bean
Apologies, there is a clear difference between considered action and the social nihilism I was agreeing with as a driver.
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I agree totally with Mad Foetus (comment33)and his /her first paragraph is a good description of what depression really is. Adrian (comment 29)may be correct in pointing out all the things that can be wrong in a person’s life particularly with regard to their job but these factors do not cause depression.They will however make a person feel very miserable and can lead to that person having very low self-esteem.
As already stated depression is a serious illness and isn’t a word to be used lightly.
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I doubt if suicide is ever the result of “rational” thinking. It is more probably the result of the “loss” of it.
Most scientific data indicates that life circumstances, especially “loss”, like the loss of financial stability, the loss of a loved one (through death or as the result of a breakup), or even the loss freedom or privileges (whether real or imagined) can greatly increase the probability of suicide.
And when this loss combines with mental illness, a history of being physically or sexually abused or a personal/family history of attempting suicide, there is very little room in the vulnerable mind for “rational” thinking…in fact, it is probably the first thing these poor souls lose hold of.
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I doubt if suicide is ever the result of “rational” thinking. It is more probably the result of the “loss” of it.
Most scientific data indicates that life circumstances, especially “loss”, like the loss of financial stability, the loss of a loved one (through death or as the result of a breakup), or even the loss freedom or privileges (whether real or imagined) can greatly increase the probability of suicide.
And when this loss combines with mental illness, a history of being physically or sexually abused or a personal/family history of attempting suicide, there is very little room in the vulnerable mind for “rational” thinking…in fact, it is probably the first thing these poor souls lose hold of.
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Joker 27
I think you will find that there is a vast difference between:
- the NEED of money (we all require it);
- the LOVE of money (most ordinary people would love to have a bit more in order to have/do more things);
- the OBSESSION with money (some people think of nothing else, to a point where it replaces real values…love, family even happiness);
- the HOARDING of money (some people just wish to accumulate more and stash it away, like misers)….which, in my opinion, borders on the riduculous, as having money and not spending it, is the same as not having it!
I, personally, have nothing against money, in fact, I rather like being in a situation of not having to worry about tomorrow. BUT, in “any” society where money is the “sine qua non” of all things; and the definition of happiness is “having money”; and where a person must be well-off in order to be of worth and regard to anyone, there is a definitely a higher risk that the “less resilient” will be tormented by thoughts of their inadequacy…which may result in their desire to “cease to exist”.
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#35, you seem to be confusing depression and great unhappiness. Depression is an illness, unhappiness can be very severe but it still does not make it depression. Bereavement is one of the worst cases for anti-depressants being needlessly prescribed.
Suicide may not seem rational to those who have never felt the need, but at the time you consider it you don’t have other options. I understand that people cannot know what it is like to be trapped in your own mind unless they actually experience it, but it is possibly one of the scariest things you can experience and to look to a future where it won’t get better but may well get worse…
Circumstances can bring around mental illness, we do all have our breaking point but those breaking points often do not take the form that society might think they do and it is more to do with a number of stressors in a specific period of time rather than the severity of one stressor.
#24 “I don’t think suicide in itself is an indication or mental illness; some people who consider suicide are perfectly rational, and consider it as a perfectly reasonable option. ” Suicide is always an indicator of mental illness. If you are talking about self-’mercy killings’ then while the media still refer to that as suicide it is not medically considered in the same way that a non-’mercy killing’ suicide is, for obvious reasons.
It’s worth pointing out that plenty of people with mental illness are capable of great rational and logic, it’s a myth that they are all irrational all of the time. Many people use logic to deal with their condition, their symptoms, and lessen the need for medication, unfortunately this is only usually possible if you have a certain type of brain, and it usually requires a high IQ (which may be part of the cause of the mental illness in the first place). Still, they live with the possibility that one day they could entirely lose their grasp on reality and that is not a pleasant thought.
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#33 and #38 Well said!
Depression, when self-’diagnosed’ in the first instance, is hardly ever depression. Most diagnoses for people with depression are made when someone is visiting their doctor about something else entirely and happens to be asked the right questions, or through being taken to the GP by a family member or friend who is able to give a truer picture of any changes in the patient’s behaviour. Your ‘usual’ personality and medical history are also relevant to making a diagnosis.
Not that I can recall the discussion but my GP had seen a change over my previous visits, he asked the right questions and I gave the ‘wrong’ answers. I’d only gone for a change of migraine medication but had a psychiatrist at my door within an hour. I wasn’t ‘just’ having a hard time, or suffering from a bereavement.
On this issue I will limit the details as I do not wish to aid anyone’s attempt to go to their GP and get diagnosed with depression when some small and simple changes to their life would do the job! Suffice to say that, from my studies and from personal experience, depresson is a void of emotion rather than a strength of negative emotion. And it cannot be diagnosed purely by the emotions of happiness or sadness, a wealth of other emotions are involved.
Maybe a good way of thinking about it is that sadness is to depression what happiness is to joy.
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Born warrior
I do know the difference between the definitions you gave. My post was spurred on by undertones from other earlier posts using the terribly sad and unfortunate position some people find themselves in as leverage to express their soapbox political and economic views.
The reasons you give in your 2nd paragraph are not impossible but are very implausible. If people feel inadequate financially they are likely to lack confidence or feel life is worth it in general through depression. In other words their financial situation is a minor element and not the overriding factor… otherwise people not in financial hardship would never commit suicide.
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@ Leah Holmes #42
I think you’re playing with the words. I can see a difference between being depressed, and being clinically depressed; but if you want to only use greatly unhappy and depressed then fine.
“…Suicide is always an indicator of mental illness…”
I can’t agree. I’m talking about somebody who is ‘greatly unhappy’ making a rational decision to intentionally end their own life; what is that if not suicide? self murder??
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Joker 44
I apologize if you were offended by my comment, I have (and had) no doubt whatsoever about your grasp of the English language.
What I was attempting to do, was point out that the use of these words is often linked with a person’s opinions…political et al.
Opinions are formed by feelings, and feelings grow from a person’s experience and thoughts. Some people on this thread think that the great divide which exists between the “Have’s and Have not’s” is the reason for many suicides. And I am tempted to believe that those who live in poor housing conditions and just about make ends meet, probably understand “downheartedness” far more than those whose live relatively well. Therefore, I think it would be a serious mistake to underestimate this aspect.
As for the plausibility of my views…well, I wasn’t trying to create a “plausibility struture”, I was just airing my thoughts on the topic in question.
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Such a broad subject but here goes with my opinion, there have over the years been many able and capable people who have tried to bring to the attention of the various departments in Jersey the failing of society in Jersey to accept drink, drugs, teenage pregnacy, gambling, divorce, bullying etc as a problem, all have differing effects on people. I know of people who have lost their jobs both in the States and private sectors for daring to try to set up help and support for people in their hour of need, until Jersy accepts there is problems the suicide numbers will increase, it cannot be allowed to continue with the attitude.
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Jersey has a very poor health and social services. It seems all the doctors do over here is prescribe drugs to any tom, dick or harry!
I have a friend who has been prescribed anti-depressents since she was 8! That is terrible, she now believes that she HAS to take them now. This i believe is why there are soo many people on this island on them, believeing that they have to take them.
I believe there should be better and more councelling in the island, to stop people feeling sorry for themselfs. I am 18 years old and lots of poeple i know (who are of a similar age) are prescribed anti-depressents, sat with no job and not trying because they feel thet have an “excuse”. Which i may add are receiving benefits for sitting at home watching TV etc..
I also agree with Vikki where most of the “ex”- heroin addicts are getting better homed and being put high priority. I know of many heroin addicts that are housed in nice estates/ flats and being given benefit money from our TAX that we payfrom working hard. I feel very strongly about this as it is not fair that we should have to do this. And this is very common in the island.
Drug and alcohol i also think is a disgrace as they are not addressing the problem properly. I as an 18 year old know many girls/ boys of my age playing around with this drug. Although i have know leant as i have lost friends/ family through the drug is that there is no such thing as “playing around” with this drug, it snatches people from their friends/ family and all people that care about them and leaves them in a discusting state.
Drug and alcohol should be going round the school teaching and showing children what can happen if you play with fire as it was.
To be honest i think that the government do not know what they are doing.
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A big issue here re. the numbers is the suicide pact in old age and the norming of suicide as a rational response..when as others have said above the vast majority of people who die are ill. Do we treasure our older people?
Social inequality has been proven to be key (ref: The Spirit Level, a good accessible, evidenced and salutory read)tax and more equal company structures are the things proven to create more equal societies, Jersey not hot on either (thus huge houses on coast and tax avoidance as normal and respectable way to make a living).
Social exclusion is also big..anybody here stopped inviting someone because they weren’t part of a couple anymore/were hard work for a while/been a bystander to ridicule and bullying?
Alcohol is massive and is recognised as such but economic arguments appear to win out. I’m guilty as any of laughing off heavy drinking of friends and being part of the banter. I’m not going to anymore. I recently held a tea and cake party instead of my normal fizzy dominated and it went very well!
Suicide is complex and beyond the above the solution does not lie with one agency or even the indivdual, we all have a part to play.
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Born warrior
No need to appologize – I wasn’t offended, but thanks for the comment anyway.
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48…Sadly spot on……out of the mouth’s of babes and all that …..you post is both honest and accurate….what a disgrace our society is we employ droves of people to do things they clearly are hopeless at ,and yet we permit this juggernaut of a civil service to roll along using millions££ of our tax burden…to produce what…? a service which is of No service…just employing people for nothing…yet this young person highlights the problem..spot on.what a sad and damning indictment..if any politicians read this…grab the nettle will you…?
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Hmmmm?!
Well stress is a feature of modern living and it is apparent all over the Globe that it increases as population densities increase.
We are all victims of what we deem our own success or failure in life.
We each have experience of both in our lives, some would say disproportionately.
How it effects us individually depends on how grounded you and those around you are.
As for suicide,it is not something that applies to just one type of person, neither is it applicable to one category of wealth.
It can happen at anytime, at any age, in any category of person, and the reasons are just as varied!
As for Jersey, we have dull depressing days which can be boring, but we also have our West Coast views at sunset,and the sea even on a Stormy day! And fresh air to breath!
There is something to be said about being a place that attracts people in search of inner Peace for whatever reasons.
Sadly they don’t always find it!
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You can argue all you like but at the end of the day suicide is 60 per cent higher than the uk…..people also drink too much over here.
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#45 for your question I would suggest that it could be attention seeking, and I don’t mean that in the negative way that it is usually used. I mean someone crying out for help that simply isn’t transpiring, who resorts to their last act to get through to people how in need of help they are. Attention that is both deserved and necessary.
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Leah Holmes 54
I doubt if suicide is a cry for help, but maybe those “half-hearted” attempts at suicide are a way of saying “I’m lost…find me!”
My friend’s brother took his own life a few years ago (after many attempts…usually at Easter or Christmas), he was healthy, wealthy and much loved, but for some reason he decided to end his tormented existence.
I will never forget the words he wrote to his sister: “I’m sorry. It’s not that I want to die but I just know I can’t go on living”…his words tell us nothing but say everything.
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@ Leah Holmes #54
Well I can’t agree that somebody chooses to end their life, ‘to gain attention’.
Maybe if they’re martyring themselves for a cause, but not if just through being greatly unhappy with their life.
I think some people just don’t want to live doing something that has no positive attributes for them. It’s not illness, it’s choice.
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Why don’t people who moan about jersey try living in the UK for a bit try london if you think flats are small here, try the crime rates in london try the cost of travel in london and the cost of housing not to mention no beaches to walk on
I am sick to death of the complaining if it so bad leave make a bit more room for those of us that love jersey and enjoy it (ones who have lived in UK and moved back)
I love jersey
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Like some of those who have posted comments on this thread, I have had firsthand experience of MND – though on the watching/caring side rather than the experience itself. I think one of the best descriptions of clinical depression I came across was the loss of the grey between the black and the white. The loss of joy – everything black, everything slipping down the scales so good becomes average, average bad, and bad, well that becomes very bad. Good doesn’t get a look in and happiness is completely forgotten. Self-medication (ostensibly to forget all the bad) then often occurs – over drinking, self harming and also drug taking – prescription, OTC or illegal. Whilst self-medication almost always leads to a worse state of mind for the unfortunate, you could say that it is a rational act to try to get some relief from an over-worked negative brain.
Mental health issues affect all social strata – not just the poor (and there are many who despite financial hardship never have mental health problems). There are also a large proportion of elderly people who suffer from depression: who was the last person they saw, do they have health conditions that leave them in constant pain? Whilst Jersey does have a drinking culture it is not the cause of MND. Work, home, loss of faith and physical stressors do play their part, but it is the way that the person is able to deal with these that is key. Each person also needs to be correctly diagnosed and prescribed treatment. Treatments vary widely from those who do have a genuine chemical imbalance to those who require more talking therapies such as CBT or just simple relaxation such as Tai Chi.
The major problem with MND is the stigma attached to it. People feel unable to talk about their problems (especially the men) or do not have the social network to do so. I am therefore quite heartened that there have been so many impassioned posts on this topic. We need to raise the awareness of MND and release the stigma attached to it. Offer to help friends through their problems – be that listening ear. Also think about raising money for the unfashionable mental health charities rather than the many (albeit equally worthy) other charities out there. Adopt a granny! Or why not offer to help with their shopping?
With help, we can prevent someone taking their life by being there when they need us.
Thank you for reading this long post.
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#55 & 56, apologies for not explaining myself very well. By attention seekers I was meaning those who attempt suicide but do it in circumstances where they are 99.99% certain they will be found in time. It does happen, but I feel it is still serious that someone has been let down to the extent that they feel the need to do that.
Born Warrior, your friend’s brother’s words are very apt. I can’t think of any others that better explain that feeling.
No matter what is going on in the exterior of your life (the bit others can see), if your own brain is waging a war against you the exterior is completely irrelevant. And that can be the case with anyone. I hope your friend’s family are receiving proper support.
For many the only thing stopping them committing suicide is the worry over doing such a thing to their family, how their family will cope, and it is a constant battle with their brain to continue to live just for other people! Unfortunately that battle is exhausting.
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Sum I think your post is fabulous. The only thing I would add is that not all people with mental health issues or severe depression die by suicide. There is a lot of work (Hawton et al) that suggests that alcohol is key in that it facilitates impulsive behaviour and the use of violent methods which do not allow for last minute intervention…as say an overdose would. Jersey’s excessive drinking culture (like inappropriate prescribing) is a problem. It seems to me that people using alcohol for self medication are not often identified as a cause for alarm..drinking heavily before you go out is seen as normal and fun…and then as you say it’s about how someone deals with a situation.. like being dumped. I’m sure that double vodkas don’t help.
We can all start gently challenging behaviours like that now. We can be aware of the services that can support people with desperate life histories. Our social networks are what give us resilience…maybe all of us beyond a certain age need to adopt a youngish man!..allow them to drop any macho and isolating shell and support every remmnant in our culture which says that financial success isn’t all.
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Agree with the drink comments. When I worked in Jersey I walked past pubs open at 9.00am, already full of drinkers. Utter nutters.
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Deputy Dawg says “You can argue all you like but at the end of the day suicide is 60 per cent higher than the uk”
Err well, maybe it is. But this seems like an irresponsible misuse of statistics. Age and gender have such a large impact on suicide rates that it is misleading to lump them all together. In Europe suicide rates in women are consistently a third or a quarter of those in males. There are marked differences in the rates between the age groups. Therefore it is accepted to report figures as age adjusted and separately for the genders. Jersey does have an unusual age spread tied in with times of large immmigration. The UK has a more elderly population than European norms. Without age and gender separation Jersey’s figures would be expected to be higher than the UK’s.
Also with the small figures involved in Jersey there are simple statistical tests to show how confident you can be that you have a genuine difference in rates rather than this being a chance finding. This may require lumping 2 or 3 years together to give meaningful results.
I hope these figures were oversimplified for the press, and alone are not going to bring about a marked and possibly mistaken change in policy.
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Tom H, what a caring and empathetic post to all those who don’t have that stamp in their passport and are finding life desperately unpleasant whilst in your arcadian island.
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