Ferry fares to France too costly?
Wednesday 6th January 2010, 3:00PM GMT.
Condor Ferries operates the only car ferry service from Jersey to France
MORE than 60 per cent of Islanders who completed a major new survey think that the cost of taking a car to France on the ferry is too expensive.
And 34 per cent think that the cost for foot passengers is also poor value, according to the Jersey Annual Social Survey.
The survey was carried out by the States Statistics Unit who sent out 3,300 written questionnaires to households across the Island.
Just over 54 per cent of homes responded and of these, 42 per cent said that price was the most important factor when booking a ferry trip.
Nearly half of those who answered had not actually taken a ferry to France during the 12 months leading up to the survey and said that cost was the main reason for this.
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One word: Monopoly!
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There is nothing new here but what could the states & Tourism do to help?
May be reduce harbour fees during the winter months & encourage condor to put on more sailings.
There are some fab deals from condor at times – yet for most of the year especially school holidays the fares sky rocket to the point where it is cheaper to fly to the UK and hire a car at the other end.
I would love to travel to France more often, yet the price does put me off. So, come on States of Jersey what can you do to help? May be a ferry run by the States of Jersey, like the way Guernsey run Aurigny?
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bring back solidor, cheaper and a better timetable.
the corsaire small boat from albert quay was good value for money , sadly only for foot passengers.
yes the cost is the biggest factor for me if i am to travel to france.
i for one would welcome the french boat back, hopefully without the daft restrictions.
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Unfortunately this is a direct result of an unscalable business. The fares must be high to make up for the running costs of the company and boats, the only other alternative is to allow another company to walk all over Condor putting them out of business by offering cheaper travel or to subsidise the current business. It would be a pity to find Jersey at the whim of UK or French run ferries but thats the risk that you must accept.
I can however give you an example of how cheap ther fares are; I recently booked a car and 5 people Dover – Callais return and it cost me £51(total!!) the same trip Jersey – St Malo I was quoted £275 a big difference I will agree, but do I want to see Condor gone?? I don’t think I do!?
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Calling it a monopoly is unfair, the island does not have enough business to support two profit making companies full stop, two stuggling companies maybe but then you always have the risk that one may fold given a bad season leaving people with tickets they cannot honour.
It is also unreasonable to expect a company to barely make an income, why would the owners/directors go to the trouble of running a high risk business for nothing?!
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What about the other 40 per cent ?
Was their answer too rude to enter into the survey?
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Absolute rip off, and the to the UK also. We can never get the deals you can from the mainland. Condor know they have us by the short and curlies. So where are our illustrious leaders? Sorting out the price fixing? Whats that you say? Head in the sand. . la la la . . cant hear you, have they gone yet? etc etc same old . . .
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Two more words for Andy, Emeraude and LD. Well, I guess the second is just initials rather than a word, but you should get the message.
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Did they really need to waste the money and time undertaking a survey to discover this?
“Just over 54 per cent of homes responded and of these, 42 per cent said that price was the most important factor when booking a ferry trip.”
Really, the price? Who’d have expected that…
“Nearly half of those who answered had not actually taken a ferry to France during the 12 months leading up to the survey and said that cost was the main reason for this.”
What, during a recession, with the ridiculous taxes and prices over here, people travelled less? Crikey, I’m baffled…
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“MORE than 60 per cent of Islanders who completed a major new survey think that the cost of taking a car to France on the ferry is too expensive.”
What and 40% thought it wasn’t, who are these people, Condor employees?
All off island travel is extortionate, especially ferry travel – as the previous comment says – monopoly.
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Why do we need yet another survey to tell us what we already know, as i’ve said before:
Jersey/St. Malo car plus 2 adults average £120
Southampton/Isle of Wight car plus 2 adults average £55
journey time for both trips circa one hour, only difference there are other operators’ on the Isle of Wight route which equals competition, something the States will not allow on an equal footing here!!!
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Monopoly is right, it is a lucrative route with no other operator. What I could never understand is why it always costs slightly more to go one way from Jersey than one way from France. I thought ‘we’ were the tax haven?
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Since the demise of HD Ferries we have not been to France with the car.
The strip of water between here & France has to be one of the most expensive in the world to cross.
I realise that this is partly due to the people who were elected to govern & look after our interests …mmmmmm
Would I travel on Condor……..as a last resort, if there was absoutely no other way….& I would begrudge every penny that I paid for the ‘priviledge’
I am a born & bred Jerseyman & I feel very sad that our elected members put up with this daylight robbery….but then ….most of them are probably cast from the same mould……
an indigenous Jerseyman
John
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I was quoted the outrageous price of 300 pounds return to France recently, and still Simon Edsall tells us we get good value in my opinion he should go to the same planet as some of our ministers. About time Condor gave us a fair deal, not a lot to ask really after all they need us as much as we need them.
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#4
You can also go Dover-Calais £5 return as foot passenger.
They make up the money by on board shopping,therefore more people more spending so can afford to give cheap day returns.
pity condor can,t grasp this .
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Sadly, another survey where everybody has a good moan about cost! And half of the respondents did not even use the ferry last year – I did, on three occasions. Not having my own Sunseeker, I have little option other than to use Public Transport, which works out a hell of a lot cheaper than buying and maintaining the Sunseeker, and I get to take my car !
I am looking to go to the UK in September for 4 days, and Condor verses flying and hiring a car works out the same. So on this occasion, I will take my car on the ferry.
The reason that people find things expensive, in my opinion is that they don’t earn enough to satisfy their desired standard of living. live within your means my friends!
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Condor as always been expensive to France, and if you go to the UK, with a car you are looking at over £430.00, I now never go with condor it’s cheaper to Fly and hire a car.
We need another Ferry Company then the price would come down and more people would use the Boat and not the plane.
The only good deals on condor is the people coming from the UK on the Boat, its us on both islands that have to pay the price.
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Why has condor got the monoply? Because the states has let them.
We were told by the states, that there would always be two seperate operators, one on the north route and one on the south route. so what has happend?
Our week states members folded in and condor got what they wanted.
Bring on P&O, will see then if condor like competition!!
Marc
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Why can’t one of the UK ferry companies that go to St Malo start picking up and dropping off here? They make all their money onboard and it might help tourism as a bonus!! wouldn’t that make more sense than trying to start up a new company that will undoubtably fold within 2 years…..
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A tip – if you are planning on booking any trip by Condor, always consider booking in person at their counter at the harbour, or over the phone.
Several times now the internet booking system had quoted one price, but having phoned or booked at their counter I have been a charged a cheaper price.
This was not only with a car to France, but also when booking as a foot passenger to Guernsey.
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GMR #5: “calling it a monopoly is unfair”, errr, no it’s not, because that’s exactly what it is. It is the sole operator on all sea routes off this rock and therefore it has the monopoly – therefore it IS a monopoly.
It is cheaper to sale from St. Malo to the UK with Condor than it is to join the same boat in Jersey and carry on up to the UK. And when we complain about it, we are told that it’s because Condor offer a year-round service. Maybe the Brittany Ferries’ boat should be encouraged to stop off in Jersey en route from St. Malo to the UK – then let’s see how prices fall.
Although Bella’s comment #15 does make sense, Condor, especially on the Clipper, charge way over the odds already for their food; it cost me over £25 for two hot meals and two drinks when I sailed with them just before Christmas. Although the food is good, it’s not £25 good. The cost of the cabins has gone up too, from about £60 to about £110. You get a “free” breakfast now, but come on, £110?
There is nothing about Condor that I would say is “good value for money”. Nothing.
If competition is not forthcoming, then the States should seek to regulate fares.
And, in a parting thought to Condor, maybe if prices came down, then more people would use the ferry. Pile it high and sell it cheap!
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I guess there is an assumption that they need to be using the kind of fast ferries that they do for this journey. In reality the ferries are somewhat overequipped for such a short journey (I know, they usually just stop at Jersey en route elsewhere, but who says that has to be the case).
And indeed the type of ferry used makes them unsuitable for even what I would class as ‘barely choppy seas’. Maybe there should be a smaller ferry with less amenities and with slightly fewer sailings each day that just covers the Channel Islands to France. It would cost less to run, the journey would be a bit longer but there would be less weather-caused cancellations and we’d still be able to get to France cheaper!
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Good idea 19/21
After all Brittany ferries pass here en route to st.malo from portsmouth we could even sail to said instead of flying,
The food on ferries from dover is nothing like over=inflated prices on condor
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The States wasted money to find out the obvious, as usual. What will the consequence be? Nothing. A rich island – governed for the benefit of the rich. And the rest is allowed to moan on topics selected by the JEP (after all, as long as they moan happily, they won’t take any action). As Engels wrote about Jersey over 100 years ago: “There is a lot of amusement to be got out of this posthumous feudal set-up… the whole mess is endlessly ridiculous.”
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It would be great to have Brittany ferries on the route but can,t see them wanting to stop at Guernsey and Jersey en route from Portsmouth to St. Malo as this would pile on the extra hours to get there.I don,t think we have a big enough population to have another operator although i would love to see more than one operator to choose from.Would be nice to see Condor buying a proper traditional ship for the Portsmouth route with entertainment on board like other operators, that trip on the Condor ship is dire!!
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Monopoly and a total rip off.
About time they got some competition in.
So what if Condor go down or lay off staff.
Jersey water and JT are doing the same.
JCRA says its tough but thats the way it goes.
No decent deals on Condor since HD went.
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The thing I resent more than anything is when Condor writes to me or e-mails me and thanks me for my support and custom. They could do this if I had a choice about who I sailed with, but I don’t – so I’m stuck with them if I want to get my car of the rock. Their thanks imply that I have a choice.
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Just a point for thouse who think that we are being ripped off by Condor, if the route really is a license to print money, why are other operators not trying to musscle in on the route ?
I am old enough to remember when it was extreemly difficult to get your car off of the rock, cars had to be crained on to the boats, there was effectively no service car service to France and to go to the UK with your car in the winter months was virtually impossible.
Notwithstanding the fact that St Helier Harbour is small, and tidal, preventing large ships such as the Britany Ferries ship docking in the islands, I am unsure what the options are. If Condor gave up the route, we would probably have a summer service only, if we were lucky.
Yes, I would love to be able to go to France with my car for the day for £50 but it is not going to happen.
The Dover to Calais route is an entirely different market, there are about 15 ramps in Calais, and the large ferries arrive and depart with the regularity of a bus service.
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Warren, get real no Insurence Company will cover you to attach a car too a Private Boat.
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how about we shipped our food supplies from france and the carrying of cars was a by product as such.
this may make the route more viable.
and the labeling of food would only need a sticker on it.
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Re # 29 – please explain !
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We could have larger ferries operating here, i.e Brittany Ferries, they could use an improved St.Catherines Breakwater. Then We could have real choice and therefore lower costs.
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Bring in one or two of the bigger operators from the UK & France, who could do UK to France Via the Channel Islands and who could probably also sell package deals to both Jersey & Guernsey, filling up some of the Islands’ hotels and which would mean lower (and fair) fares to the UK and France for Channel Islands residents. It will never happen though, because that would require States members to have brains and use them and to actually care about the residents of the Islands rather than only being interested in protecting their own jobs and (in some cases) wealth!
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Totally agree Condor are a total rip off what happened to Sean Power he got elected first time round partly on the Condor issue now he does nothing at all!!
Bring in competion and what is the point of a competion commission {JCRA} when they do nothing about all the monopolies in Jersey and Condors is one of the worst
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#34
yes and he also said he would bring in a french supermarket.
promises promises till they get elected and prove to be just like the rest.
keeps himself well in by not increasing cigs and drink.
All some of them think about is themselves and whats best for them.
The rest of us can go whistle
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“… what happened to Sean Power he got elected first time round partly on the Condor issue now he does nothing at all!!”
“yes and he also said he would bring in a french supermarket.
promises promises till they get elected and prove to be just like the rest.”
More fool anyone who elects businessmen to the States.
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good point warren , no other operater is in a hurry to fill or compete with condor. Day trips should be much cheaper for a start ten quid for a day trip is more like a price than 30 quid that they charge
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I visit Jersey as tourist in the summer, and find the fares rather remarkable. We have a ferry (among many other routes) here in Denmark – its a high speed ferry sailing about the same distance as the distance between St.Malo and St.Helier, but the price is half !!! and we even pay 25% in VAT.It should be possible to do it cheaper than Condor Ferries does.
This is only my humble opinion.
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Condor has been abusing our situation for many years. They charge people from the UK less than us and will hike prices at the sniff of a school holiday or comercial travellor, HD ferries gave them a run for their money I agree they did not have a fully reliable service but they were never given enough support and encouragement to continue. why do we not have a slow boat facility to france as with the UK. Can you really tell me brittany ferries would not be an option for our harbour and it would potentially bring more people from france and the UK en route!
The pricing is a disgrace Jersey investors in property over in France are known to be selling up because the ability to move between St Malo and Jersey is far more complicated and costly.
If you are on a low budget over here you are a prisoner your ability to travel usurped by a greedy government too blind to see how much damage it causes with every trivial and impractical regulation it sets in place.
Start protecting your people not the greedy corporate bodies taking money away from the island to fill their pockets.
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Went as a foot passenger to St.Malo last summer…cheaper than some cab fares…however the prices of stuff in France….extortionate….
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#38 Annette, I don’t know very much about Denmark. Do you know if your ferries are subsidised at all?
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No other ferry operator is interested in the Jersey route. Why would they? There is not enough demand to make one operator viable, so why would they bother setting up in competition?
Why would Brittany Ferries want to waste their time extending the crossing time by 2 hours just so they could take on an extra 15 or so cars.
If Condor could, I am sure they would happily give up the Jersey/Guernsey route to concentrate on the far more lucrative UK route. What many correspondents here seem to willfully overlook is that Jersey is an island of about 100,000 people. A totally different ballgame to running routes from the UK.
By the way, I feel slightly qualified to comment, since for a period of 18 months in the mid-noughties I was the most frequent Condor traveller on the Jersey/St Malo route – over 300 crossings a year. On some of those crossings, there was no more than 2 cars, and the crew outnumbered the passengers. This happened more frequently that you might think. How much do you think it costs to sail from St Helier to St Malo, including fuel, staff costs etc, and how do you think that compares to the fares they receive from 12 or 13 passengers and 2 cars?
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I am coming to Jersey from St Malo for the weekend (this weekend) I cannot make the time for the boat on Friday evening and although I would like to stay in Jersey until poss Mon it is impossible to do so as there is a service on Sunday night then nothing until Thursday evening.
It is not just Jersey residents that are being held to ransom but also those ex Jersey residents that cannot afford to live on the island anymore but still have relatives and friends that they like to visit!
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In response to 42. Wilf – But was this when we had Victor Hugo/Emmeraude sailing? Possibly all the cars/foot passengers that are now forced to use Condor now were using Emmeraude back then due to their better pricing hence Condor was empty?
Just a thought..
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@Laura #44
Yes, Condor used to be empty because, if you remember correctly, Condor wasn’t allowed to sail directly to France; it had to go via Guernsey, therefore adding an hour to the journey, at least.
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#42 it’s a catch 22. Prices go up less people will go, prices go down more people will go, and somewhere in the middle there may be a viable, workable cost? Then again, there may not be. Still if the happy medium was found the ferry company would eventually get greedy, up the prices (because people obviously want to use the service), and gradually customers will fall away again. The happy medium, if there is one, needs to be maintained.
Still, what about smaller, slower ferries that are cheaper to run?
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strawbs 19 has surely highlighted a point that if one or all ferries operating the UK To France route were to stop here, their passengers would then surely be able to purchase duty free items on board.Currently not available to their passengers I believe as they are not travelling outside the EU. Not a money spinner for Jersey but it could offer it’s residents a choice of operator without huge costs or risks being taken. I hope my comment is seen as a little more positive than most on here, albeit many are signing from the same song sheet.
Surely there is a states member who will at least look at the possibility of investigating. It may well be that simply those vessels on that route are too large to enter our harbour
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No-one has so far commented that the sailings have decreased. Guess what no sailings on a Friday evening for 3 weeks in March! No-one can get here easily from France either. Less trade for Jersey, more misery for those owning homes in France or just wanting a winter break off the rock, that is if they can afford it. No-one forget how the States damaged Emeraude by giving the ramp licence to Condor too. Come on Condor you got the cake so now share it, don’t just eat it!
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Condor has maintained a monopoly here with the backing of the staes.They do as they please – example their timetable for 2010 shows no sailing on Friday evening in march despite many people travelling evry weekend to france very regularly. in fact those travellers in many ways help to keep the company afloat. if the staes support Condor they should also support islanders in ensuring a fair fare and adequate servcie. als travellers over the last year have suffered from delays due to ‘technical problems which usually leans an engine is not working and the journey takes longer than scheduled. finally Condor 10 returned to service this week afetr being in ‘dry dock’ and lo and beholkd we have just been told it os running late once again due to ‘technical difficulties’
We are a captive audience who pay through the nose to escape ‘the rock’ on occassions.
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