1

Chris

No one earning less than statistical £31k will live comfortably in Jersey 2010. Everybody earning less will have to rent cramped dump accommodation and go without modern comforts. No education or cultural life of any sort.

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3

Matt

This old chestnut again and typically brought up by the JDA. What I want are answers and suggestions to making the Island more affordable and not a load of waffle about it being expensive already with no plausable solution!!!!

Come on JDA, start tabling some solutions for a change and stop telling us the blooming obvious!

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5

NannieP

Plainly speaking the answer is no but researching the subject is not enough and a waste of funds. We all know that people of all ages young and old are merely surviving here but what is going to be done.

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7

Laurent

Depends, it appears to be the middle classes who have the largest problems with affording to live here. Those who decide to breed in order to get a free flat seem quite well off to me. I heard two 16 year old girls in a cafe the other day saying how lucky their friend was to have had a baby lately as she was getting so much in benefits. They then went on to debate whether to have a child now too, or go to college first – “as it’s such a doss” – before becoming a parent. I actually despair.

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9

Wilf

Chris, even earning more than twice than that meant I had to live in damp, dingy accommodation. But then I was stupid enough to think that having children, ie more than one, in Jersey might be a good idea. So, we left. Best move I’ve ever made.

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11

Geraldine

Regrettably and very sadly after living in Jersey over 50 years each we had to leave on retirement as we just could not have lived comfortably on our pensions. At least now in warmer climes we do not have to worry about heating, food is 1/3rd of the price and the people are happy.

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13

kareneliot

Who was it who said ‘lies, damn lies and statistics’? You can do anythign with numbers, especially when you start using ‘averages’ or ‘percentages’. For a start the £31K ‘average’ income refered to above creates a false impression. Income does not follow a normal, symmetrical ‘bell curve’ distribution, with equal amounts of lower and higher wage earners. It is skewed to the right by a small number of super-rich high earners, dragging the ‘average’ income with it. The majority of the population meanwhile remain to the left of this ‘average’, leaving the impression that the most people on the island are less well off than average or even in ‘poverty’ (often defined as 50% of average income or below). This surely has the effect of making the majority of the population disgruntled with their lot, as their perception is that they are less well off than most when that is not necessarily the case.

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15

truthseeker

The truth is the rich have filled their boots,made huge amounts on property,hiked the prices so high the average person does not have a snowballs chance in hell of their own place…especially if there has been domestic seperation/divorce…children are very expensive to have and look after, the rent control tribunal was dismantled and the curse of rent rebate..all swelled the coffers of the money lenders and developers, and the quality of life lived on the island has slipped lower and lower,we are a society of I’m alright Jack,mentality and to hell with anyone else,this used to feel like a community..and that people mattered… greed, avarice and the continual quest for money and ego boosting gestures of grandiosity are seen as cool and desirable whereas belonging, friendship and pride of citizenship were so important,I wonder if we really realise how when those values go we have left becomes a material wasteland with a dog eat dog attitude…come on people wake up..let’s have reform and as Barak said change we can believe in.

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17

Rozel Aubin

‘Who can afford to live in Jersey?’.

All those who currently live there. Otherwise they would have left, surely?

As Matt might say, “blooming obvious!”.

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19

Blue Knight

I know it has been said before, but more competition is needed to bring down prices of food and drink. Why are the States so reluctant to allow cheaper supermarkets, like Aldi, Lidl et al, into the island?

I can cut down my living costs by about 20% by shopping in these outlets.

Then you have Wilkinsons that sells cheaper household goods. If you allow shops in of this sort, the local shops now charging the earth, will have to look at cutting their prices, hopefully making it easier for the less well off.

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21

Im Handsome!

I wonder how many low earners who whinge and moan
about how tough life is over here, with the usual quallies and rent rant actually stand in the pub all day boozing there heads off,followed by the ritual of hanging on the door fagging away and gauping at truly respectable individuals like moi and mois wife.

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23

mad foetus

Rozel Aubin hits the nail on the head.

Jersey is like everywhere else: there are the rich and poor who don’t worry about money and a middle class that gets squeezed.

Jersey is a wonderful place to live. What makes it wonderful is largely free: the beaches, the cliffs, wonderful walks in every parish, the fantastic cultural stuff that would put any similar sized town in the UK to shame.

If anybody thinks a cheap supermarket is the way to improve Jersey, I would suggest they should ask themselves why they are living here in the first place.

Jersey will never be a cheap place to live. Islands aren’t.

As for £5.80 for 3 loaves of bread, here’s a suggestion: go to a charity shop, buy a breadmaker for next to nothing and bake your own, if the money bothers you so much. It costs that much because rents and wages are so high: if you want cheaper bread campaign for a drop in the minimum wage.

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25

Eric

Why live here if it is so awful? Nobody forces incomers Stop moaning and go if you don’t like it

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27

Leah Holmes

#23 “Jersey will never be a cheap place to live. Islands aren’t.”

This is where you’re entirely wrong. Some islands have a higher cost for food/fuel etc, but because their house prices are perfectly reasonable (compared to the salaries of the inhabitants) they are no more expensive than their respective mainlands. In that respect Jersey is very different (at least to the UK).

I like Jersey, I like the Jersey people, I like the scenery. Thankfully THOSE things can be found in many, many places. There isn’t anything positive which is that unique about Jersey unless it is where your were born and raised (and your family are).

What I really hate about this place, and I do mean hate, is that I had only been here a couple of weeks when the undercurrent of ‘only money matters’ started to make itself very prominent through the media and more generally (eg. in getting talking to people). For some that is the length of a holiday!

That is a horrible attitude to prevail in any land and a very bad advert for Jersey.

Now, I know there are people that work in the finance industry that get low-pay, I am not targetting any individual workers in this comment, but I cannot think of any reason why this attitude is more prominent here (compared to most of the UK) than the fact that the finance industry is so dominant (i.e. in numbers of company and personnel). It certainly is nothing to do with Jersey being an island.

It’s the kind of ‘City’ attitude that is, of course, prevalent in parts of London and it is a hideously ugly attitude.

I believe it is the minority of Jersey residents that actually care THAT much about money, but it a minority that get heard because of their money.

The States really need to make a bigger effort to listen to EVERYone and to make it CLEAR that EVERYone’s opinion is valued, but I guess since such a (relatively) large percentage of voters have enough money… well ‘they’re alright Jack’.

This is an attitude of which Jersey, as a whole, should be very embarrassed and which they should actively be trying to discourage. In no way is it caused by the majority of residents, but it will probably take the voice of the majority to stamp it out.

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29

cam

moan moan moan

why do most people feel so hard done by count yourself lucky you dont live in Haiti

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31

J Lamborrari

@ Chris # 1
“…No one earning less than statistical £31k will live comfortably in Jersey…”
Maybe that should read ‘No one with an income less…’ I know of one person who (based on last years figures) had an income in excess of £31k, and around 50% more than myself in near identical circumstances; the only difference was I worked 45+hours a week earning my income, theirs was 100% Income Support.

I believe there should be Income Support(and other benefits), but they should be a safety net to cover the bare minimum living expenses of those in need; not provide a lifestyle that gives little reason to aspire to working for a better living.

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33

TA

No 29 – cam.

Just waiting for the ‘boat in the morning’ comment……

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35

Darren

FAO Leah Holmes

You’re right about the the island’s obsession with money. However, this rather crass attitude is intensified by our quallies system – Jersey is an island where status is the bedrock of our society. I have my quals, but there are times when I think we’d have a nicer, fairer, and more affordable island if we removed our quallies system completely

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37

Blue Kignt

Can someone please explain whether it is just as expensive to live in the Shetland Islands as it is in the Channel Islands? If not, then surely the arguement over shipping and air freight costs go out of the window.

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39

Michelina

That fact that they are looking into this to see what they can or should do to help the people who live in Jersey is a start..
And I’m glad that it is an outsider that is doing it.
Why should people leave Jersey if they are not happy, especailly if they are settled here with family etc.
Making life a little easier for people isn’t a bad thing.
Yeah there are people in other parts of the world who are worse off than us and we should be grateful for what we have and alot of us are, however I would still like my rent, food, bills and flights boats etc to be slightly cheaper so that I could atcually afford to have a little bit more of a life on this Rock that I call home.. And hopefully one day buy some thing so that I can give my son a better life than I was given. I never went without but I never had it all either. My mum worked hard and bless her when she died did not have much to show for it.
There is no shame in feeling this way and wanting things to be a little cheaper so be able to acheive a more comfortable life style.
Is that not what we all want for ourselves and our children no matter what part of the world your in!!!!

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41

rico

They could start by saving money in trimming down States Members. Perhaps they could start with the illusive Syvret seeing as he isn’t even showing up anymore or even in the Island yet still being paid. Then they could move onto some of the back benchers who contribute nothing of worth.

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43

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #27
What a confusing post.

You say that after only 2weeks of moving here and talking to people you were aware of an “…’undercurrent of ‘only money matters’…”, yet you say you believe only “…minority of Jersey residents that actually care THAT much about money…”

Maybe you should just not socialise within the minority that talk in a way you hate.

“…they are no more expensive than their respective mainlands. In that respect Jersey is very different (at least to the UK)…”
You’re right to say in that respect Jersey IS different, because Jersey doesn’t have a mainland in the way that many other island communities do. Many other islands don’t ‘suffer’ such large differences in costs as they operate under the same laws and tax regimes as their mainlands, as a result they don’t have some of the employment oppourtunities available in Jersey, and therefore there is not the pressure on housing, resulting in higher market prices.

I happen to disagree that the ‘only money matters’ attitude is any worse in Jersey than anywhere else, what is perhaps different is the fact that in Jersey (just as in the City) there seems to be more oppourtunity to come by money, so it’s in plain sight; whereas in a community that doesn’t have an exceptional industry such as finance (in Jersey/London, or oil in the UAE, or movies in LA) the chance to get rich seems more distant, and therefore less time is spent thinking about it; it doesn’t mean that people think any differently.

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45

Gemma

If it is too expensive here then just move somewhere else. Moaning and winging. We would all love to live in Monte Carlo but can’t so why should Jersey be any different? Life is too short to clutch straws and the JDA help nobody with this latest load of nonsence.

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47

mad foetus

Per person, Jersey has the lowest rate of taxes and about the highest rate of public spending of any place in Europe. That, unfortunately for some, is a fact.

It is expensive, though not dissimilar to London prices: certainly when I bought a coffee and lunch in London and went ice skating at Xmas I thought the prices about the same as Jersey.

In other words, if you think life is hard in Jersey, try elsewhere. Try the projects in Marseille, try Hull or Angelsey, check out the deep south of Italy. Jersey is a paradise compared to those.

But all of this is surely a product of supply and demand. I overheard what looked like a builder in the street yesterday talking in a clearly non-local accent. He was saying he hadn’t worked since before Xmas and there was nothing to do.

I suspect he is struggling. But here’s the crux: do we give him support and encourage him to stay or do what we can to get him to leave? I don’t know if he has a family, but he is an unskilled worker from outside the Island. If the Island is to keep its population stable (or even reduce it), we need this type of person to not stay forever. We need him to go back to his home and tell people that there is no work in Jersey.

We simply cannot keep growing. And the best way of achieving that is by making it difficult for unskilled persons without links to the Island from coming here or staying here.

I wish the cost of living was lower: we all do. But I want a sustainable, green Jersey. And that means, in my view, no more and preferably about 10,000 less people on this Island.

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49

Neil VFC

rico is right, get rid of states members like Syvret and start saving money. States members should show leadership for a change and value for money.

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51

CP

Jersey is a small island, therefore, as long it remains an attractive place to live, the cost of land will remain high.
It is my opinion that the States are acutely aware of this and are pursuing a policy to make the Island less attractive. Public support to ‘cheapen’ St. Helier will surely advance the decline.

‘Cheap’ supermarkets are unlikely to lower the price of products to the consumer. What they will do is introduce inferior products at a price lower than that of superior quality products.

I would encourage those who moan about living in Jersey to go now, and maintain their current standard of living in the UK for 5 years.
However, consider expenditure on council tax, water*, sewerage*, gas/ electric, road tax, CO2 tax, MOT, parking, etc etc. On top of which you’d probably earn less and may have to travel over 1 hour to work every day (if you still have a job). If you do end up making any money, consider inheritance tax and CGT on any profit from sale of assets.

*Note- separate bills – 1 for bringing the water to you and another to take it away. Hope JNWC don’t see this.

@28.Leah Holmes – That’s beautiful.

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53

Blue Knight

J Lamborrari # 44. Thank you for the information you provided on supply and demand. I wonder if anyone can provide further information that will corroborate your view that fares to travel between Scotland and the Shetlands are subsidised by the tax payer?

Also, if goods are imported in greater quantity into the Channel Islands than the Shetlands, then shouldn’t that have some impact on prices? We are often told that bulk buying gives retailers the abilty to purchase goods as a lower price.

I go back to my earlier assertion and that is competition is probably the key to reducing the cost of living in Jersey. If the cost of living is reduced, employers don’t have to increase wages / salaries and retailers don’t have to increase prices to cover their costs.

The same applies to the public sector, they States won’t have to increase salaries so much, so the costs of running the Island would be reduced as well.

Okay, someone is bound to shoot my theory down in flames and tell me I am being over simplistic……well I am just giving my point of view.

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55

Leah Holmes

#43 J Lamborrari, it wasn’t confusing if you understood the fact that it was an ‘undercurrent’. The people I talked to felt that money mattered so much to Jersey that it came out in conversation as I asked generally about Jersey. And some of these people were pretty well off, they still didn’t like that attitude. It wasn’t that the people I spoke to themselves felt that money was that important. It’s an attitude that comes across on the news, in the papers and predominantly in the States and Jersey’s legislation. That’s why I say that I believe the majority of people do not think life revolves around money, I suspect most Jersey residents are decent enough to understand that health, happiness and a pleasant society are far more important, but do they (or any of us) actually have a say? In the meantime legislation, some States members and a few very vocal people make it entirely clear that money is the be all and end all.

#45 I’ll reiterate what I’ve said in another article in the past, why should someone have to leave their partner? Not everyone’s partner is in a position to up and leave Jersey, some people are under contract to remain here for a specified time. So by you’re reckoning they shouldn’t live together in Jersey? Well this ultimately leaves two options: 1. Jersey people can only actually date other Jersey people 2. The Jersey person leaves Jersey to join their partner. The first one is utterly idiotic and unworkable and the second one is a pathetic and selfish attitude that unfortunately the States clearly agree with. Jersey would rather lose its own talent, the people it has helped raise and educate, than be just a bit more welcoming to that person’s partner?

My partner couldn’t find a suitable girlfriend in Jersey. So many of his age-group went to Uni in the UK and didn’t return it greatly diminished the choice of potential females and also left it slightly skewed towards those without a university education. He’s not against someone without a university education but given how intelligent he is the chances are that most people with a similar level of intelligence will have completed university.

#44 “this is down to the oppourtunities for employment it seems.” “Shetland, because it doesn’t have the appeal that the CIs do” Shetland has a lot of appeal to a lot of people, it also has job opporunities, the difference is that job opportunities in Shetland are mostly for people who have the creativity and/or skills to make a living self-employed and do their business electronically. Then there are those that work with the land and the sea, but then there are those in Jersey to whom such jobs are inferior This means it requires people with a lot of guts, willing to take on the pressures of self-employment, and I don’t doubt that both that and the numbers of people who have the right skills for self-employment are less than the number of people worldwide with the knowledge to work in Finance. The Shetlands are absolutely gorgeous and extremely interesting, they are also friendly and welcoming. Jersey people are welcoming and friendly, Jersey (i.e. the States) are not!!!

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57

Leah Holmes

#35 Darren, don’t get me wrong (from other posts) it’s not that I’m in favour of the quallies system, I’m not, it’s just that I can see why there has to be some sort of system and until someone can bring in a fairer one… I wish someone had the answer to that one.

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59

Blue Knight

Leah Holmes # 55. I visited Shetland in the late 70s, when I was in H.M.Forces. In those days it had thriving businesses linked to the oil and gas rigs in the North Sea, though I guess that has died down a bit nowadays.

Shetland used to have excellent air links at Sumburgh airport, indeed it had another airfield as well – just a landing strip with no terminal buildings. The people there were just as hard working and innovative as the residents in Jersey. I’ll bet that their cost of living is less than that in Jersey however.

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61

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #55
So your view of Jersey is that it’s full of ill-educated, uncreative and gutless people who feel that any job other than finance is inferior.

I’m totally at a loss as to why you bother to live in Jersey.

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63

BeanThere.

If they have to ask the question…..they already know the answer. Ofcourse the majority of the population are struggling, this is an island centred around the greedy who feast on the poor.

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65

Logical 931

I agree with Banking Bean-instead of another useless review why dont they review who qualifies for all the handouts and what percantage are genuine cases?.
I am a single mother and have always worked to support my family so why are others allowed to sit at home all day even though their children are at school/ nursery? Was the idea of free nursery places for all not to encourage people back to work?
What is the crieria to get income support and why does this appear to be a way of life for a lot of people over here. I am not referring to people who are unable to work- but the ones that can and choose not to because it is made too easy over here

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67

Mogit

Simple question – simple answer, if you’re employed probably, if unemployed or retired no….. next question please !!!

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69

Blue Knight

Thomas Payne # 62. (Or is that Thomas Paine, the revolutionary?) You say Jersey is more of a fractured society; well much of the British Isles suffers from this problem.

I haven’t lived in Jersey for nearly ten years, prior to that I lived on the island for most of my 50 + years. Believe me Jersey is less fractured than you think, despite the often inept government. The States have over many years, created a successful finance industry, but money isn’t everything. It would be far better if they had a happy and contented population, by having a level playing field where there is competition for the major retailers in the island. The high cost of living is a contributory factor for the discontentment in Jersey. Remember there isn’t always contentment in wealth, but there is wealth in contentment.

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71

God's Mentor

I love living in Jersey, work in Finance, have a J cat, more money than I can possibly spend and a nice house overlooking a beach. The only thing that spoils it slightly is that there are still too many locals. If you don’t like all of us newcomers coming to this island then there is of course a boat in the morning…

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73

Leah Holmes

#61 I wouldn’t comment since I personally have never made such statements about Jersey people, indeed I’ve said quite the opposite when others have been suggesting exactly that.

You’re missing the point that I’m not here for Jersey, I’m here to be with my partner. It just happens to be Jersey. Is it really fair that Jersey makes it unbelievably difficult for the partners of people that were born and grew up here? In case you’re wondering, the answer to that is “no”.

But then if the Government has so little consideration and respect for the people that were born and grew up here, frankly I can’t say I’m that surprised. This isn’t about you, or the person next door, or any Jersey individual, this is about how your Government portray Jersey to the outside world AND to those that live here (through total choice or just circumstance). And it’s not a good portrayal at all, and it doesn’t do the Jersey people any justice!

THEY are making this island seem like a nasty, self-centred, money-obsessed little rock, and I know there are Jersey people that do care that this is the image they are presenting, even if you don’t.

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75

Leah Holmes

#56 Morning Boat, so very true. Someone asked me recently why I thought I was entitled to an opinion on Jersey, the reply was simple ‘I pay my taxes and my taxes pay the States’s wages’. We have a right.

Having an issue with how terrible the Government are does not mean we hate Jersey people or Jersey the place, and if people can’t distinguish the difference they need to open their eyes a lot.

I’ve lived in both. I’ve also been raised in a major city, and in a part of Scotland with fresher air, beautiful beaches, stunning scenery, much lower cost of living, general air of friendliness, and NO crime!

I do come across people in Jersey who simply because they are on the defence (they think Jersey is being attacked) go into rose-tinted spectacles mode. How I wish people could just realise that nowhere is perfect, not even Jersey, and work together to solve the problems. Governments everywhere cause problems and get things wrong, don’t let it divide the people.

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77

TBean

I was born & bred on this island, worked hard to achieve a degree & subsequent professional qualifications. I tried to work in the island post quallies but was forced to move away as the cost of housing was completely out of my remit. We have reached a point where the only people that can afford to buy here hail from outside the island. When local people can no longer afford to live in their own places they sell up & move away. It just fills me with such dread the death of jersey is coming…

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79

Leah Holmes

I guess the answer is for the UK to start putting a 5-year residency restriction and a 10-year housing restriction on people from Jersey, in fact I think I’ll start campaigning for this to happen. That means that everyone, with only a Jersey passport, struggling to afford to live here or find work here will be absolutely trapped and at the mercy of the States and the greed of a few! I can imagine the fuss THAT would cause on the island.

It’s funny how it seems totally unreasonable when it’s turned around onto you.

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81

Homard

Well done Gordon, well said. If you are Jersey born you should take precedence over any incomers.

As John Avery said, inmcomers are here because it suits them. And they pay taxes. Those taxes pay for services which are used while they are here. It does not confer any right of ongoing residence or any moaning rights.

If you want to see how it is properly done, look at Australia. Big place, strict immigration. And woe betide you if you are one of the “whingeing poms” which Jersey unfortunately seems to attract.

The saying about the boat in the morning has stood the test of time for a good reason. It is true. If you don’t like it, pop on the ferry!

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83

Ronnie Postgate

The most vulnerable target groups are local. Their treatment borders on being a human rights issue – they are discriminated against in the workplace, and have seemingly absolutely no rights. They struggle to live in Jersey, which to some is good news. That’s presumably why non local businesses and even some local employers treat them badly, so they will hopefully leave their own island. Perhaps this study should only be directed at residents with quals, these are the only people who seem to suffer, particularly those with ambitions. If you go to, say France, and try to throw your weight about you quickly find that they look after their own. In that respect, Jersey is an anomaly. The abuse should be stopped by politicians with courage.

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85

e

How about setting a maximum amount rents in the island can be charged. £2,500 for a 3 bed house with garden is far to expensive, the rich are getting richer. Housing’s equivalent is £900 ish. Level the playing field. Allow the Polish, Portuguese workers to rent what locals can rent. I agree with setting a time limit on buying a property but for goodness sakes let them rent what they want.

If I were to move to the UK next week. I could rent or buy any property I chose to, why don’t we give the same back to our guests.

I’m local and I can ill afford to live over here.

I feel for the people who have come here from other countries

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87

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #
“…The islands are applying a 5-year residency law to which are partners of Jersey-born people) BUT the UK does NOT apply it to Jersey-born people do they? How is that fair?…”
How is it fair that I can’t move to America, or New Zealand? Why should one country allow other nationals in anyway, if the UK decides to adopt such a rule who am i, or any Jerseyman to complain? It’s up to them how they run their country, a similar respect for how Jersey chooses to run itself from immigrants would be nice, rather than calling for tit for tat legislation.

I was born in Jersey, and I can’t afford to live in Jersey anymore; but I don’t blame the immigrants taking the jobs I could be doing, I don’t think they’re greedy coming to Jersey for the higher wage than they could earn in their homeland.

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89

Hedley Byrne

Most verbose postings do prevaricate somewhat. To cut to the chase, yes, it is expensive. But let’s not use this post to slag off the island or its indigenous people. If you come over here, do your jobs and grow up!

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91

Mark

I am sure all the problems would go away if we all just wore cycle helmets

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93

Bertie

Well Donald at *84, I think that this shows a fairly consistent clarity of vision which brings a breath of fresh air to debate in the island.

Perhaps you were born too late, but not too late for Jersey!

And don’t let the temptation of a one bedroomed flat in town with parking space at some time in the future for you and your partner compromise your present ideals!!!

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95

JULIE

Alfred J (comment 88)As I said in my post if a person,particularly Jersey born,loves their island but it is the ridiculous cost of living which makes it miserable or impossible for them to remain then surely it is wrong that the only answer is for them to leave?Yet you,and a few others,seem to think it is a simple alternative for people to just pack up and go elsewhere.I chose to leave as I was desperate to leave Jersey but I was still concerned that my choice may be wrong (and my husband was very unsure at the time but gave in to pressure from me!!)We have no regrets and are very happy but it is a huge decision and not one which you should have to take out of desperation.For us the cost of living was only one factor and there were many other reasons why we wanted to go elsewhere but I would have felt extremely let down if I had been squeezed out of my birthplace because I couldn’t afford to live!!

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97

Alfredk

No Julie, you misunderstand. No Jersey born person should be forced to leave their own island. Not what was meant at all. The idea of any indigenous populace being displaced by incomers is wholly repugnant but it does seem to happen in Jersey. It is awful that you had to leave your own island.

We need politicians with the courage to protect locals and to stamp out the discrimination against the Jersey born which oocurs all the time. One feels that we will be hearing much more of this subject in due course, no doubt to the annoyance of those politicians who would like an easy life as well as their 40 grand plus!

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99

Lowlight

RB Bougourd; very nice idea about reviving the Morris Minor after its demise in 1971. One of the problems, however, was that of its labour intensive construction method, particularly the semi coach-built traveller version.

Then there was the issue of crash testing and safety which came about in the 1970s. Although the Minor was a strong car, it would have needed much re-engineering to pass the tests, ironically because the structure was probably too rigid!

A final upgrade in October 1964 brought in limited safety features, including a safety steering wheel (but not a collapsible column) but that was about it.

Don’t forget, as well, that the Minor’s styling had become very dated by 1971, having continued largely unchanged since the late ’40s. Although the car is regarded with the utmost affection now, it is difficult to imagine it continuing to sell in the rather flamboyant 1970s.

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101

Gutted

I work in an international bank, earning a decent wage. I drive a £250 car which is falling apart, live in states housing because I can’t afford to buy over here, and am stressing out cause of the cost of living here. . .

. . . On the other hand, my next door neighbour has four kids, drives an £18k brand new jeep. Must have spent thousands on her kids at christmas and buys her son a new phone every week just to keep him happy.

Guess what. . . She is on benefit! AND , get this, AND, she has her boyfriend living there and hasn’t declared it!!!!!

My kids got £300 spent on them at christmas.

Whay is it that all these benefit bums who can’t be bothered to work have a bloody decent life. While us working lot get screwed by the system!?!?!?

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103

jon

is it me, or is a survey into whether it is too expensive to live on this golden isle somewhat ridiculous. i understand the cost of most goods due to shipping and accept that to a point,but lets just take housing for a moment. im trying, god forbid, to find a house or indeed, more accurately a one bedroomed flat in jersey. im local, have lived here all my life bar three years i studied at uni. so far the best price i can find is 160, 000 pounds. now, i dont have that money and on my meager wage will not have till im about 40. Rent i hear you say, at around 600 to 1000 pounds a month for a decent establishment, i think not. the idea is to save for a house, no p**s my money down the drain. till then i have to live with my parent, and as much as we get on and they love having me at home(who wouldnt)i would like to try and set my own life up. the one very sad thing i have realised is that i cannot start in jersey without a mortgage around my neck like a set of stocks, therefore i have to move back to the uk, away from my home and the job i love so much. I know your heart bleed at my plight, but think seriously for one moment, should this be fair???? perhaps the island should invest in affordable housing for the young locals, not executive flats for the middle aged yuppies!!!!

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105

Leah Holmes

#84 Oh dear, please do accept my apologies for caring that my partner who was born here, has lived here all his life and contributes greatly (and voluntarilty) to help many small businesses on the island (that the States make it increasingly hard for) should have his life made hard just for falling in love!

#100 Born Warrior, you’re still missing the point that my partner is NOT an immigrant! So you agree that he should only be able to choose a partner from within the limited pool of females his age within Jersey? Not something anyone would ever accept if it was forced upon them

My partner is a ‘Jersey family’, one of us not being from here doesn’t change the fact that one of us IS!

Waow, people really struggle to understand some pretty basic stuff.

#92 My mind doesn’t change, people just don’t bother to actually read!

#86 thanks

#87 “How is it fair that I can’t move to America, or New Zealand?” Cause they CAN’T move here! Point being you CAN move to my homeland without restriction, I can’t move here without restriction. D’uh.

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107

Robin Hood

wow. is it me or is there an inordinate amount of discontent around these days? Was this always the case or is this a new phenomenon? I don’t remember these ongoing arguments 10 years ago.

Seems to me its something new and directly corelated to the exponential growth in wealth here over the past 10 years. Pour lots and lots of money into a small place and watch the people get more and more angry and frustrated. Like poor “Gutted” #101. Have a cup of camomile tea, gutted, and ponder the following:

“Money never made a man happy yet, nor will it. The more a man has, the more he wants. Instead of filling a vacuum, it makes one.”
Benjamin Franklin

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109

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #105
“…Cause they CAN’T move here! Point being you CAN move to my homeland without restriction, I can’t move here without restriction. D’uh. Report abuse…”
So why not bitch about their governments? Seems to me the government operating outside the norm is the UK.

If the US government changed the law to allow free access to Jersey’s less than 80,000 people, would you think Jersey’s government would be acting unfairly if they didn’t open the door to their greater than 300,000,000?

“…Waow, people really struggle to understand some pretty basic stuff…”

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111

Crosby stills and

L Holmes at 105 posted:

#100 Born Warrior, you’re still missing the point that my partner is NOT an immigrant! So you agree that he should only be able to choose a partner from within the limited pool of females his age within Jersey? Not something anyone would ever accept if it was forced upon them

Talk about obtuse! The gentleman said no such thing.

Waow, people really struggle to understand some pretty basic stuff

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113

Leah Holmes

#109 “Seems to me the government operating outside the norm is the UK.” No, only people with Jersey passports can move to the UK and take up employment freely, not those from SA, the USA, Australia, UAE etc etc. The UK is perfectly normal in the restrictions it sets, just for some weird reason it doesn’t set them against Jersey people. It is the Channel Island and IoM that are unusual.

I now believe the UK should set restrictions on Channel Islanders and Manx people. There are clearly too many moving over there taking jobs from locals!

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115

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #113
“…The UK is perfectly normal in the restrictions it sets, just for some weird reason it doesn’t set them against Jersey people…”
So the UK’s policy is ‘perfectly noraml’ and ‘weird’ at the same time… okay!?

#112 “…Still failing to understand that I’m not asking you to open the floodgates?…”
No, it is you that is failing to understand Leah. If Jersey was to allow unrestricted immigration from UK then that IS opening the floodgates; whether you believe the flood would not come or not, the potential is there, and the damage caused by a flood takes longer to put right than preventing it in the first place.

“…allow partners to bypass the 5-year residency rule for employment? Do checks if you want, I don’t care…”
The present policy already allows for this, but you must be married. I personally think it would be impractical to try a formalise non-married partnerships in the way you seem to want, what happens if you and you non-married partner break-up? do you have to advise the States and face losing your job? Totally unworkable.

You have to be realistic, the law can’t change just to suit your very specific requirements, to the detriment of the majority, unless it’s an unfair law, which I don’t believe it is presently.

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117

R B Bougourd

“No, only people with Jersey passports can move to the UK and take up employment freely”

Nobody even asked if I had a passport when I went to live in the UK, Leah. A birth certificate got me onto the system. No photo id. needed then, multiple claimants didn’t exist then!

You might need one now as identification before they will let you embark, but you don’t need one to enter England from Jersey.

A “Jersey Passport” is only a British Passport issued in Jersey with a variation of style. It might have “Jersey” on the cover but it also has “European Community” on it. What a joke!

Anyone qualified to hold a British Passport can obtain one issued in Jersey if they can be bothered. Get one when you need to renew, they make you feel special, although you may not have needed a passport if Jersey is the only place you have visited outside the UK so far (please do not read this as sarcasm, it is not meant that way, just being factual).

Unhappily, and this is where a lot of ill feeling arises, some Jersey issued British Passports contain a clause barring the right to work etc. in EEC Countries.

I’m not quite sure why your partner needs to be such a martyr in all this. At least he is with someone from outside the gene, or is it, bean pool. (I normally don’t use the “b” word. They didn’t exist in my day and I certainly wouldn’t afford it a capital letter!) and above all he is one of the elite – a Jerseyman. People make sure that their kids born are in the Island just to achieve this sought after commodity!

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119

Jersey Manx girl

This is a very interesting thread a lot of good points also a lot of bad points,i for one was forced to leave the island because my crime was to have children,my self and my husband are middle class or working class i can never tell the difference we had a 2 bed flat paying £800 a month rent,and i put our daughter into nursery which was costing £900 a month i was on maternity leave but i had to go back to work.Paying £1700 a month before we even bought our food or to pay any other bills was killing us.We went down to social to see if they could help us and they could not because we did not come under a certain criteria ie single parent or a couple with only one adult working,we told them it would only be till our daughter goes to school but it made no difference we only asked for a bit of help and we were let down we found you are better in some cases not working.We never had a life we were working hard to pay the bills with little left i started to resent having children i new then it was time to leave.So we left and went to the isle of man it was hard at first my husband got a job in M&s and me as a bank Clark we rented for a while a 3 Bedroom house for £700 a month but nursery fees £400 a month we also got £80 a month child benefit it does not matter if you earn £1 or £1.000.0000 pound you still entitled to it,the doctors are free and we also shop in tesco.3 years now we have been here its a lovely island and we have now bought are house with a second child on the way we have got are life back but i think of Jersey every day i was brought up there my family and friends are there but i could not afford to live there.Jersey is a wonderful place if you can afford to live there don’t leave but if you cant then there are just as nice places else were.
Jersey Manx girl

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121

Cornishman

‘But would I be able to buy a nice flat with ease in the UK so close to the beach or the town/city centre on my wage?’

Depends where you go. In say Falmouth in Cornwall it would not happen. Imagine if you lived in Cornwall instead in a town such as Falmouth (which is like St Helier). It is less likely you would be able to get the same wage as most jobs in Cornwall are in the tourism sector and Falmouth has the same problem Jersey does with expensive accommodation due to the fact rich Londoners buy up properties as holiday homes.

At least if you are a local in Jersey, there are opportunities to get decent wages, in Cornwall the disparity between the poor locals and the rich incomers from London is huge.

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123

Leah Holmes

#115, we’ll just have to agree to disagree. Having lived in the UK most of my life I realised that few people care about Jersey and Guernsey. Even now, despite the news coverage of HDLG and tax evasion, you won’t hear them mentioned unless people know you live there or come from there. Plenty of people don’t even know what the islands are! So you might get an influx of the super-rich, but the States are actively encouraging that anyway, you certainly won’t get your average earner, they couldn’t afford it, hence, no floodgates. If people want to live on an island they have plenty of choice within the UK while still benefitting from mainland shop prices.

#117 Nice post, made me giggle My partner’s fine, he’s definitely not being a martyr, he is one of the few that wouldn’t qualify to hold a British passport (until we marry anyway, which we’ll have to now I guess). He has worked outside of Jersey and the UK in a self-employed role so it doesn’t pose any problems, but he can’t be away long-term from Jersey till some contracts end. Bizarrely his previous passport didn’t have the stamp for some reason, another friend’s current passport has the same error! I totally agree that the passport situation is a joke.

#119 It’s a shame you had to leave, but I’m glad it worked out for you, the Isle of Man is lovely.

#116 It’s not exactly something you can keep from them in a worldwide financial crisis. I grew up during the last big recession and heard all sorts of horror stories of what my generation’s future would be like, I’d wager that most people have this experience, it’s just life.

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125

Nick

‘I now believe the UK should set restrictions on Channel Islanders and Manx people. There are clearly too many moving over there taking jobs from locals!’

Leah, at least people from Jersey would by in large work. There are way to many immigrants in the UK sponging off the system after they jump off a lorry in Dover and claim asylem! At least Jersey does not have that problem.

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127

Harold Hairy

One has to admire the tenacity of the prolific, self rightous and misguided poster on this thread and elsewhere on the site. Clearly someone with too much time on her hands

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129

Jambo

Whether you can afford to live in Jersey or not, it makes no difference!

Jersey old boys and Jersey politicians still run the island how they want too…

The most pointless survey EVER!!! And no doubt cost 100k.

If the results show the majority of people can’t afford to live here, will they put prices down, ie. cut GST…ummm NO!!!

And if the survey shows the majority of people can afford to live here, no doubt GST will go up!!!

If you don’t live here, or used to live here, save your opinion, it means nothing, just like the people who live here!

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131

J Lamborrari

@ Leah Holmes #123
“…hence, no floodgates…”
You’re simply wrong Leah; the floodgates WILL be open, what you mean (I suspect) is that there will be no flood… right now.

But what happens in a year when the economic climate possibly changes and Jersey’s in boom, while the Shetland Islands suffer a severe downturn?

Do we act reactionary and slam the gates shut again? What about those businesses in Jersey that were relying on incoming staff and the stability of the States policies? what about the people in the UK who’d made plans based on the same stability?

It’s very easy to complain about policies that effect YOU, TODAY; but you really do need to step back and look at why those policies are in place, and accept that they’re there for the good of the island as a whole, not just to inconvenience you and your partner.

@ J Lamborrari #124
Hello, what a coincidence we have the same name!

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133

Mike

I wonder how the cost of this work will be described in ye olde States of Jersey ledgers. “Playing to the JDA’s ego” might do it. Do political groups have egos? Nah, surely not.

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135

Clare

The bullies are back out in force trying to oust anyone who dares disagree with them. I wonder why I spend my time trying to teach children that bullying is wrong?

I’m Jersey and sometimes I’m embarrassed by the way we treat incomers, but the childish bullying on here really takes the biscuit, are you emasculated in the workplace/at home? Jersey is not perfect and it’s not somewhere that most people would aspire to live. I love it because it’s my home but I have been treated far better elsewhere than incomers are here. If people pay tax they have a right to a voice, and since they don’t get to vote I imagine this might be one of few places they get to have a voice!

Some of you are a disgrace to this island, God only knows what damage you are doing with this attitude to incomers.

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137

moops

I know of a 20 yr old lad that has not worked a day in his life not because he can’t but because he is bone idle. He goes out drinking all night, sleeps all day and he receives £90 job seekers allowance every week even though he lives with his family and doesn’t pay rent utility bills or for his food. This is where the states should be looking to save money. I’m sure there are many many more like him who have a great life with money in their pocket for doing nothing. I work in finance, I am married to a man with a professional job and we have 2 kids, we are all Jersey born and we struggle daily to afford basic things. We don’t drink,smoke or go out partying we haven’t had a holiday in years, like many other working families we live hand to mouth. It makes me angry when I see ‘benefit families’ living comfortably on hand outs even though they are more than capable of going out to work

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139

JD

I am a recently graduated student, hailing from Jersey and now living and working here full time. My partner, who is UK born, got a job immediately in Jersey, where he works hard and earns far more than he did in the UK, even without a degree.

We pay almost twice what we did in the UK in rent but most importantly we are happy here, and are willing to pay for the privilege. Of course it’s expensive! But no one is making us live here, and we are certainly not complaining.

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141

Claire

The dustmen are back out in force after Christmas doing a great job, as are the postmen and other essental workers. I wonder why I spend my time trying to teach children that littering is wrong?

I’m Jersey and sometimes I’m embarrassed by the way we treat incomers, but they often really bring it on themselves by moaning about the island are you emasculated in the workplace/at home? Jersey is not perfect and it’s somewhere that most people would aspire to live. I love it because it’s my home but I have been treated far better elsewhere so I wonder why I stay sometimes!Locals do seem to fare badly in the senior employment market. If people pay tax they have a right to use services, and since they pay less tax than elsewhere they are on to a good thing! I also imagine this might be one of few places where ex-pats get to have a vote!

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143

Nick

Leah – i’m sure you have some incomers sponging, but I doubt you get many trying to get on a ferry to Jersey who are from Africa, China, Afganistan and so on.

You can still control your borders, unlike the UK – despite the fact its is also an island.

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145

deputy dog

Jersey is expensive for food and property otherwise not too bad a place to live taking away the clowns who run it.

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147

J Lamborrari

@ truthseeker #132
“…had it that in staes rented accom or states loan you could only be expected to pay back one fifth of your salary for your housing as it was deemed you needed the rest to live on…”
What’s your point?

Are you saying that somebody living in States housing earning £15,000pa should only pay £3,000pa for their 3bedroom house, while somebody else earning £15,000pa is paying the same amount for a 1bedroom flat?

Sounds like half(or maybe just 1/5) of a formula, the result being ≤ disaster.

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149

Leah Holmes

#143 Too true, some on here forget the UK is an island and suffering the negative effects of overpopulation more than Jersey is yet. Jersey will though, there’s no way around it.

People, ignore the troll ,the moderators seem unable to do anything about the saddo.

#131 “But what happens in a year when the economic climate possibly changes and Jersey’s in boom?” I really admire your optimism, it’s looking like Jersey is suffering every bit as much as other places, and you tend to feel it more on an island so I don’t fancy Jersey’s chances. Thankfully people that don’t worship money will probably pull through it all okay.

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151

Clare

Kenneth, who are these local politicians that care about incomers? They don’t even care about us unless we’re rich, what hope have incomers got?

I’ve done my research, I read the JEP and often browse for comments. I’ve seen a certain minority bully and bully and bully, so far the count is at 5 people being bullied, is that relly the impression we want to give to people that have complimented the Jersey people? If the bullies cannot see who they are then they can identify themselves from this pattern. Once they have established someone with whom they disagree they twist words and nitpick, then they name call, then they mock, then they post pretending to be multiple people to form a ‘gang’ feeling. They’re the Daily Mail reading, Have Your Say types of people that society looks down on.

You must be an awfully sensitive soul to assume that someone is attacking the island just because of comments on policies and the Government, I don’t take it personally, why would you? We don’t even like the policies or the Government, and anyone who contributes to the system has to be allowed their say. I’ve read lots of compliments about Jersey on here, from all sorts of people, but it’s not a surprise that the Government itself gets criticised. You should only take that personally if you’re a States’ Member

Clearly there doesn’t have to be offense for you to take offense. Don’t be so sensitive.

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153

Jonathan Dibble

Wow, there really is an agressive person here. Number 152 takes the honour. Woe betide anyone who disagrees. If you don’t want to be loyal that is a matter for you. Just don’t be surprised if ignorance brings forth strong and informed response. Most bullies seem to have a go at the locals so at least we agree on that point

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155

Homer nodded

There does seem to be a problem with a particular poster having set herself up as a self-appointed respondent and supervisor of other people’s comment. Freedom of speech is a wonderful thing but it does involve respecting other opinions, particularly where one recently joins a community.

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157

J Lamborrari

@ John #149
“…Greed Island/Jersey wins…”
I don’t get it?

How can ‘Greed Island/Jersey’ win, if the greedy can’t afford to live here, according to your ‘simple answer’?

@ Leah Holmes #150
“…I really admire your optimism…”
I wasn’t looking for your admiration, I was looking for an answer… but I guess if you don’t have one I’ll have to make do with admiration.

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159

Reginald Harper

If Clare doesn’t know which politicians have an interest in people at grass roots level then I would suggest that she conducts some research.

In my experience, no person is wholly disenfranchised in this island. Of course, an individual states member might be unable to do anything in a given case, but then again he or she might be placed to assist. I have seen things done by the odd caring deputy. Much will depend, of course, on the problem. There are other agencies as well who are placed to help persons [whether immigrant or otherwise] who are in genuine need.

The point of all this is that the commentator is incorrect in her bold assertions. I hope, by the way, that this post will not bring forth the rather personal and agressive response to which the correspondent “Kenneth P” was subjected.

This is a wonderful forum. Let us all respect other opinions and views, please.

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161

joker

Truthseeker #15
The reason house prices have risen like they have is not due to the super rich but due to the average person earning more than they used to along with increase in population and demand. The fact house prices have increased like they have is a sign of a wealthy Island and strong economy, and by wealthy I include the average earner as well and that lots of people want to live here. If no one wanted to live here properties would be worth squat which it seems is what a lot of people want.

Blue Knight #19
Cheap supermarkets are not here because of money greed or conspiracy, they are not here because they are not interested in Jersey. Their strategy of high turnover low margin doesn’t work on an Island 9×5 miles with additional shipping costs.

BS Deluxe #70
IOM residents won’t being 10% much longer now they’ve lost the VAT reimbursement from the UK which topped up their total revenues by nearly 1/3. Watch this space!

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