Francis Le Gresley elected Senator
Wednesday 16th June 2010, 9:40PM BST.
Francis Le Gresley celebrates with fiancée Jan Perron as the final result is announced. Picture: Rob Currie (00984898)
CITIZENS Advice Bureau manager Francis Le Gresley has been elected Senator in today’s by-election, topping the poll in 11 of the 12 parishes.
He finished with a commanding lead over Stuart Syvret, who moved into second place after the final vote in town, and Patrick Ryan, who topped the poll in his home parish of St John, and placed third.
The overall result was as follows: Francis Le Gresley (5,798 votes), Stuart Syvret (3,437), Patrick Ryan (3,212), Gerard Baudains (1,329), Deputy Geoff Southern (1,085), Nick Le Cornu (382), Gino Risoli (76), Philip Maguire (72) and Peter Remon-Whorrall (27). There were 113 spoilt papers.
The by-election was called following Stuart Syvret’s departure from the States because he had been absent from the Island for six months.
• Read the full results and analysis, and find out what Mr Le Gresley had to say in Thursday’s Jersey Evening Post
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15,418 votes in total from a population of over 90,000, pathetic! We certainly got what we deserve, a WET
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Well done Francis, don’t let the door slam on the way out Stuart.
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Congratulations, Francis Le Gresley – very well deserved
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At last we won’t have to listen to Syvert any more.
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Oh dear,sorry day for Jersey politics..another Yes man for the establishment….Yes minister whatever you say minister….Phleux
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How could Stuart Syvret possibly have finished second in this pole. How quick are people to forget how he picked up and left the island to seek sanctuary and lick his wounds in the UK, just to come back and stand again for the seat he deserted so many months ago….. I am bemused and amazed he did so well.
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All the members who have sat in the house were defeated in favour of another newbie.
So a vote against the house and all its works?
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Sorry day truthseeker when the guy with the most votes gets elected? Democracy init.
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Still says something that Stuart got more votes than 4th to 9th combined.
Bet Southern feels a bit embarrased.
The Jersey public will be well served by another yes man.
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Tom, you won’t have to listen to Francis either – He’ll be as quiet as a mouse ! zzzzzzz
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Not much of a turnout but Mr Syvret got the answer that his antics deserved.
Interesting, too, to see that the other sitting member was told by the electorate exactly what they think of him.
Well done Jersey.
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@5 truthseeker
and you know this to be a fact ? IMHO i think he was the pick of the litter and thank you to Peter Remon-Worral for standing for The Monster raving loony Party .
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Dear Truthseeker-don’t you think that less than 3 hours after the result is a little early to judge the man. After all unless you are psychic you have no idea of what sort of politician he will turn out to be!
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Congratulations to the new Senator, Syvret gambled and lost, at least he can go back to the UK now where he won’t be victimised and leave politics in Jersey well alone!
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Bye, Bye Stuart now your going to have to earn a living like the rest of us.
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Wonder if he will be giving up his day job and salary to concentrate on his duties within the States?
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A sad day indeed for Jersey, a vote for more of the same, no boat rocking here, cover up all that is unpleasant to give an impression that every thing in the Jersey garden is rosy. Still well done to Stuart Syvret for giving us a glimpse of how things might have been and for exposing just how apathetic people in the island are. We truly do get the government we deserve.
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At least Francis Le Gresley in his role at CAB has been doing something practical to help the people of Jersey-I don’t remember former Senator Syvret doing as much to help his fellow islanders when he was in ‘Exile’.
It’s not all an establishment plot this time Stuart- the results weren’t fixed by big brother, it’s clear that Jersey has had enough of you, bye bye!
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17 Looks like this lot of voters have disappointed you – perhaps you should choose a new lot, who would be more likely to come up with the “right” answer.
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15,000 votes !
the apathy in jersey on state matters is infuriating
people are so quick to complain but no one wants to do anything about it!
voting is such an important right and impacts on everybody’s lives so it confuses me when people just don’t seem to care
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I am so relieved that the island is finally rid of Syvret – he has been a destructive force in island politics for quite some time, costing the island dearly, not only financially, but also with regard to its reputation. Still, it’s worrying that so many people still chose to vote for him in spite of all the damage he has done. I’m also delighted that Southern did so poorly – perhaps he’ll get the message and realise that ‘the island’ as a whole doesn’t want him. Good luck to the new Senator – a decent and reasonable man with a proven track record of helping people.
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Perhaps what is more interesting than Stuart vs. Francis is the town / country divide. Stuart Syvret was actually third in most parishes until the St Helier results were announced.
Also interesting was the underlying comments that a lot of people were choosing between Ryan and Le Gresley. I think this win would have been even more convincing if Ryan hadn’t been looking for a seat. Syvret wouldn’t have got the same push if Southern hadn’t stood.
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Now a sade day for Jersey,(Not)
Now go get yourself a propper job,(if you can)
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Nemo, Stuart Syvret got ousted BECAUSE he was helping fellow islanders ! Many survivors will vouch for that ! And as far as Francis Le Gresley’s help is concerned … he was absolutely USELESS in our case. When we were struggling to make ends meet, he came up with the usual arrogant, presumptious questions to gauge our situation ; it was clear FLG had this preconception that we were struggling financially because we simply did not know how to handle money. After discovering that we did not overspend, we did not go out, did not smoke or drink or do drugs, did not live beyond our means, did not give each other expensive presents (none at all, actually), did not go on expensive holidays (not on holiday at all, actually), did not buy on credit or even have a visa card, etc. … after all that, he simply told us : “I’m afraid in that case I really do not know how we could possibly help you!” So please forgive me for NOT having that high an opinion of FLG and CAB !
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Of course. Anyone who beats Mr Syvret is either part of the “establishment” (whatever that is) or is wet. This is a vote for positive politics – voting for someone who has actually given something back to the local community, rather than a delusional individual with a history of abusing the position of Senator for his own personal agendas. Good on you Mr Le Gresley, and best of luck.
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Congratulations to Francis Le Gresley on such an emphatic victory. Jersey has chosen well.
Syvret to become an investigative journalist ha ha who will pay him to write his nonsense ?
Southern, the people dont want you !!!!
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The establishment will be over the moon.
A sad day for jersey.
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Fantastic result that Syvret has been booted out! On Syvret’s blog they are saying Francis Le Gresley is the “establishment” candidate – what nonsence!!
The establishment canditate was businessman Ryan
So Syvret got beaten by a left of centre candidate who managed the Citizens Advice Bureaux for 20 years!
Good riddance Syvret. Now he will have to earn a living at half the salary (at best) of what he was paid by the taxpayer!
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One possible reason why the turnout is so poor could be that as soon as you are on the electoral register you are placed on the list of people who can serve on jury duty. I went on the electoral register shortly after buying my house and was shortly thereafter visited by am official man who confirmed my name and then told me I must serve on jury duty.
I had to take a week off work for which I was not paid, not that pay is the main issue, I simply object to being forced to serve on a jury. This should not be mandatory although ironically the only people who would want to serve on a jury are those who should not ( I mean what sort of person wants to judge and punish another apart from a sad get my own back type ).
2 guys from work who live on the same estate were also called to Jury duty within the next 3 months and I can only assume that they work by postcode. I removed myself from the electoral register and have not gone back on it since.
It’s also true that due to the odd way in which Jersey has no party politics, a single elected person can do little to change established policy, especially if said policy serves those politicians who support it and few else – turkeys voting for Christmas?
Finally many take the view that by virtue of wanting to be elected the candidates are unelectable, much in the same vein as the Groucho Marx comment ” I wouldn’t be a member of any club that would have me as a member ”
Many feel that all politicians are self serving, lying back hander taking so and so’s and who can blame them.
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Fantastic result for Jersey.
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I predicted this result-the yes man got in and Stuart Syvret came in second with obviously more than “a handful of supporters” which so many like to claim that he has.Such a shame that so few voted and so obviously don’t care about the island in which they live.
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I am amazed that Syvret came second after all the damage he has caused to the reputation of Jersey. I guess Syvret’s fanatical supporters were more motivated than others, but thank God the best man won. Bye, bye Stuart – don’t bother coming back.
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Well done Francis Le Gresley now we can go back to normal, I was right all the time, after talking to every one in the Market we voted for the best man, well done, can´t wait for the phone in.
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Interesting analysis Pip, that the defeat of Syvret and Southern is a vote “against the house and all its works”.
Well said Nemo. The new Senator wil have a better insight than anyone of the day to day problems that ordinary people face. He is trusted and respected, far removed from the noisy political posturings of JDA, Time4Change and I Am the Great Syvret – and thank goodness for that. The Jersey electorate are not as dumb as many think.
Oh, and what future the full page ads in the JEP at future elections?
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Thank God for common sense.
Now Syvret can really concentate of slagging everyone off on his blog now that he has all this time on his hands.
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@Looby
Nearly 15 % of the population voted, Thats not pathetic. 113 spoilt papers that is pathetic! how hard is it to put one single cross in a box!, how do you mess that up?. I hope you weren’t one of those 113 Looby? Francis got 37% of the votes and Stuart in second got 22% That puts Francis 15% ahead, thats a huge margin and a clear reflection of what the island want it doesn’t get clearer that that.
I think its a great day for Jersey politics Truthseeker you may have judged the new senator in three hours but i judged you in three seconds, and i wont be allowed to type what i think without being barred! Richard Cranium.
Well done Francis the Island is behind you and with the whole Islands support i am sure you will do great things.
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Congratulations to the Senator-elect. Interesting that failed politician Syvret,( blaming the media, the establishment and everyone else for his failure, except himself) said that he will now take up a career in investigative journalism. He will soon find out that although it is not worth suing an unemployed chippie with no funds, it is much more sensible to sue any publisher who prints some of the wilder and totally unfounded accusations. Bring it on!
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Good luck to Mr Le Gresley.
Thank god the deluded Syvret didn’t get in, he is quite obviously lost in his own super egotistical world.
Makes me laugh when everyone who supports syvret obviously voted and he still only got 3 odds thousand votes.
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Real Numbers
FLG wins with 15% more of the vote than his nearest rival in a turnout that represents approximately 15% of the electorate – the people have given up.
Stop the petty squabbling and point scoring and deal with the real issues – immigration, housing, education etc which would give us something real to act upon!
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Back to exile for Syvret. Great news. About time the fantasist was knocked down a peg or two. I can’t understand how 3,437 would even consider voting for him.
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What a very sad result. Only 15% of the Island voted so this result cant be a clear vote. Gerard Baudain in his 10 years of being Deputy should have won. He is the best candidate, an honest guy for the people in Jersey and he always got the jobs he stated he would do, done. Le Gresley will do nothing for Jersey but take his huge salary, and change nothing at all, just talk talk, talk. He has no experience on anything in politics and wants everyone to pay higher tax. So either the people didnt listen, or they dont care about paying the States of Jersey more money so they can take even higher salaries from us.Bad bad bad result. Im pleased Syvret didnt get in, but at least the guy spoke up for the people and let them know the truth about the States and was not scared to talk. Of course the States dont want that, they want ud to believe thier tripe.
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#36 ’113 spoilt papers that is pathetic! how hard is it to put one single cross in a box!’
Unfotunately it is all too easy to assume that spoiling a paper is done by using a tick instead of a cross or marking too many candidates.
Until such time as it is a legal requirement to publish some sort of analysis of spoilt papers we will never know just how many are spoilt by people writing comments borne out of frustration such as “None of the above” or “Stop the gravy train now”.
I find it hard to believe that someone somewhere doesn’t get a look at spoilt papers to see if there are “lessons to be learned” or to build up a dossier on dissenters.
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DontWantOne # 36. Excellent post – ‘Nullius in verba’. Truthseeker…..whose version of the truth? Francis Le Gresley is an excellent choice.
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Well, Jersey has spoken and all true Jerseymen and women will recognise the moderate, tolerant voice of reason.
We do not want firebrands of class warriors: just conscientious people trying to do their best for the Island. Hopefully Syvret will grow out of his 30 year adolescence and Southern will resign – his views have been rejected by the Island decisively and the idea that he should now have the same voting rights in the States as Le Gresley is anti-democratic.
If he doesn’t resign, at least he should rename the JDA the Jersey Contempt for Democracy Alliance.
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Good to see that common sense prevails finally and we have a worthy senator as a result.
Perhaps the likes of Syvret and Southern will now get the message. We the electorate do not beleive you, we do not like your politics of envy and we can see through your rather childish antics and conspiricy theorys!
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What, I didn’t even hear about this till today! I have asked around and no one i know even knew that this election has happened. So much for registering to vote.
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truthseeker (5) another Yes man for the establishment…
Francis Le Gresley has 18 months to prove himself . If the electorate are proved wrong and he is a lame duck, we will boot him out. Until then I wish his a fair wind.
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To anyone who still insists on insulting Stuart Syvret and his many supporters can I just ask you to press for an investigation in to his numerous allegations and revelations.If,as some of you say,they are lies and fantasies then it is high time the Establishment proved this (easily done with their powers and available money I would have thought)An open and transparent debate could be televised for all to see and perhaps gain insight in to the truth once and for all.I shall not hold my breath however…..
As for Francis Le Gresley-time will tell.
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YAHOO!
Syvret has finally got his payback for all the lies and hatred he has peddled out to others over the past 2 years and abuse as brought up by the Chapman Report.
The man and his followers can now crawl back under the rock from wence they came.
Good bye citizens media, you failed to convince the people with your propoganda and it is over!
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The only thing sad about this day for Jersey is that the usual wingers are still chasing their tails for a conspiracy; like saying FLG is part of the ‘establishment’ as if he was voted in by the ‘establishment’. Or do they consider the public who voted the ‘establishment’? Either way the conspiracy theorists are clearly a minority as the democratically elected was not who they wanted it to be. Grow up.
Further evidence of the fact that the general population of the island do not agree with the few curtain twitchers that lurk on this and other sites is the low turn out. Voter apathy, whether because people can’t be bothered because they are happy with the status quo, or can’t be bothered because they do not think their vote will make a difference is a clear sign the people of this island are not that concerned.
Congrats to FLG.
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@ 42R B Bougourd
I see, now i understand, 113 people accidentally mistook the words “ballot box” for the words “Suggestion Box” or the:
“stick your two pence worth in and waste the good peoples time and effort box”
can you imagine them announcing the results? Stuart Syvret 207 votes for senator, and someone thinks he needs a hair cut.
R B Bougourd thats the worst idea ever im sorry.
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Just a thought – SS will now have time to pursue his action against Jack Straw – or his replacement – . Not heard much about that recently, have we Stuart?
And I hope that your leg is getting better, so that you will be able to stand when you are next in court. On second thoughts – perhaps not – you don’t have a leg to stand on.
Best of luck with the journalism, but, judging by your history, you’d be better as a stand-up comedian. Oh, sorry, you couldn’t manage that either, could you – you can’t stand.
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I’m surprised there was as many as 15,000 votes, it is completely naive to think that voting will change anything in jersey.
I think most people would agree that the states is in a complete mess, it doesn’t matter who you vote for they are all a waste of space, and the fact that only 15,000 people voted just shows that Jersey has given up!
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To anyone who voted for Syvert you are very very naive. and thank god you are in the minority.
His track record is a joke he goes on and on about everyone else but has never achieved anything in 20 years.
He ran away to the UK saying he wouldn’t stop until the UK government stepped in. The fact he came back tail between his legs with nothing shows that all his wild claims have no basis. I guess the naive who vote for him will no doubt say the whole of the UK press are “part of the establishment” ha ha Even the MPs who hate Jersey decided to keep well clear in the end.
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“To anyone who still insists on insulting Stuart Syvret and his many supporters can I just ask you to press for an investigation in to his numerous allegations and revelations”
No, you can’t. Most of us are bored of his allegations, and don’t think there is any point in investigating them further.
If Syvret had, in his 20 years in office, proposed one item of legislation that helped people to create jobs or increase profitability, we would be more minded to spend money on pursuing his pet projects.
As it is, the “Establishment” told the police (headed by Laughing Lenny, who seems close to Syvret) they had a blank cheque to investigate HDLG. And what did they do? Followed Syvret’s approach: exagerrated everything, alienated everyone, made wild and unsubstantiated allegations, accused anyone who asked for evidence of being part of a cover up and then ran off to the UK to sulk when it became clear people.
Here’s the clear message the election gives to Syvret and his supporters: go away and leave us alone. That is not an insult, we are just tired of being shouted at by fanatics. What part of it don’t you understand?
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Well done FLG – Good riddance Syvret. I opened a bottle last night in celebration. What wonderful news. Great to see Syvret gone – democracy does work when the public get rid of someone who haqs behaved so inappropriately, and elected a man who has given years of great service to the community.
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On the ballot paper underneath Geoff Southerns name was “Jersey Democratic Alliance” showing that by voting for him, what you would get is a poodle who is answerable to his party, not the island in general.
Perhaps that’s why he (read JDA) had such a dismal result in his last chance to become a Senator while still having the safety net of being/ becoming a Deputy.
I quote from Geoff’s letter to the EP
When a candidate for Senator puts his policies to the whole Island and is successful, he is able to state categorically that he has a mandate to deliver. The position of Senator does carry an added weight in decisions that affect the whole Island
I ask, does such a dismal result, then mean a clear and categorical rejection for yours and the JDA policies and mandate ?
Oh and by the way, bye Stuart
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I will never ever vote JDA again they used the establishment media to advertise there man Southern huge adverts in the JEP, did the cost of these exceed the allowance of £2500 allowed for elections?? if not will they be prosecuted I doubt it they fought for the establishment disgraceful traitors how the Jersey Establishment must be celebrating thanks JDA
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Point of order, the turnout was greater than 15% because not all of the population can vote, der. Still low, but statistically well significant – if everyone had been frog-marched to vote, the percentages would have been pretty much the same. Well done to the new Senator and perhaps the others might think the decent thing to do is to clap the new batsman in to the crease.
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JULIE # 48. It isn’t for accused people to prove their innocence, it’s for Mr. Syvret to prove their guilt and at present all he has is a lot of unsubstantiated anecdotal nonsense.
When he produces some tangible evidence that is admissible in a criminal court, I’ll take more notice. In the meantime he can comtinue his fight from outside the States Chamber.
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Quoted
15,418 votes in total from a population of over 90,000, pathetic! We certainly got what we deserve, a WET
i think you might find that the 15,418 will infact just be the total of jersey born residents.
I just can’t believe that Syrvet got that close.
Just shows the functioning of the human brain cells and how they fail people who can’t see any further then thier own noses.
I bet if Kermit the frog or big yellow bird stood they would of got voted.
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Francis Le Gresley – Citizens advice honcho
Stuart Syvret – career politician now unemployed
Patrick Ryan – own business, serial electoral failure
Gerard Baudains – own business, serial elctoral failure
Deputy Geoff Southern – career politician, serial electoral failure
Nick Le Cornu – lawyer, not qualified in Jersey, serial electoral failure
Gino Risoli – own business, serial electoral failure
Philip Maguire – crazy waistcoat, serial electoral failure
Peter Remon-Whorrall – gardener, serial electoral failure
I didn’t vote. I have no reason to believe any of the above have the intelligence and ability to work in a team that a politician needs.
To be candid, they all look like misfits.
Surely we should be doing something to increase the calibre of States members? This lot were an uninspiring shower. Hence the rubbish turnout.
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Dear Free at Last- You are of course as much entitled to your own opinion as anyone else and I respect that, but so am I, and so are the voters of Jersey who elected FLG fair and square! If we are all completely wrong then in 18 months he will be voted out and you can rightly say I told you so! Until that happens or FLG runs off for 6 months on full salary I will continue to support the voice of moderated reason that is so badly needed on this island!
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You who think FLG is a good choice demonstrate clearly how little you know about what needs doing..we have a civil service out of control,the treasurers,we have two,one spare, are guessing at how much we have..and you vote in a total green horn sin cajones!!!….Gerard Baudains only needed 18 months to get his proposal in and working a complete review of states departments,what they cost ,how they are run ,and above all who does what…Tery Le Suer has the Gall not to answer when asked these questions,can you imagine a buisness that does not know it’s cashflow,how many staff it employa and it’s operational costs,coz that’s exactly what we have here.FLG won’t have found his way round in that time and that is why you people are sleepwalking into the crash..and apologists like FGLG may not offend your sensitive feelings and you are comfy with them…but it is also why we needed Churchill when the brown stuff hit the fan and it’s coming again soon in the form of £££ collapse,but it’s O.K. you keep on with your afternoon Tea and digestives Guardian reader life style,..as boy are you in for a wake up call.
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‘Interesting analysis Pip, that the defeat of Syvret and Southern is a vote “against the house and all its works”.’
The fact that Baudians and Ryan who have been members of the house were also defeated in favour of yet another newbie does not look good to me.
Tiny turn outs in what are becoming more like beauty contests than serious political contests, a total inability on the part of the States to make any decisions at all, we are heading for our third huge debate over the future of WEB that will decide nothing at all in the next few weeks for starters, suggests to me that Jersey politics is pretty moribund.
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We have not seen the last of Syvret, he will be back in the states very soon – apparently he has applied for the recently advertisied position of Tea Lady…
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Perhaps only 15,000 voted because they are bored with the lunacy of Syvret and Southern.
A vote for common sense.
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15% of the population is a pathetic amount, but it doesn’t suprise me at all. How is voting for one Senator going to make a difference at all? We need a party system, with clear defined values.
We need a website that actually explains how the entire Jersey political system works, who does what and their ‘manifesto’s’ instead of searching for blogs with nothing but their feelings and why they would be fit to be senator. How else do you expect people to learn about Jersey’s politics when it isn’t even taught at school?
I know so much more about the UK political system than I do my own island!
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No one should be upset at the election of Francis Le Gresly, he appears to be an honest and trustworthy person.
The same cannot be said for Deputy Southern, he said he would not stand if S.S. was standing, he changed his mind, today he said that peoplesaid to him that they would have voted for him but he was already in the States and he already had a voice, brilliant!, he could not work that out for himself.
He has done more damage to his beloved J.D.A. than the establishment ever could.
How far does he expect to get with his vote of confidence in Senator Le Sueur? He should resign and let the Pitmans take over
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Excellent result.
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Great result. The people of Jersey who voted delivered a firm message to the likes of Syvret,Southern and the rest of the JDA that the politics of envy and spite are not wanted here.
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‘Tea and digestives Guardian reader life style,..as boy are you in for a wake up call.’
Guardian readers are in a definite minority in Jersey as are Financial Times and broad sheet readers in general.
Sadly Jersey political discourse is dominated by Daily Mail Lite Tories, pale blue with a hint of pink when it comes to protecting any tax benefits enjoyed by themselves or their friends and a strong streak of NIMBYism
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58. Michael
What exactly do you mean by “establishment media”?
Surely that would imply that the JEP is owned by “the establishment” (that tired phrase that really means nothing more than a scape goat for people to blame when things don’t go their way).
I think you’ll find the JEP is a privately owned business, and is therefore impartial. As I understand it, everyone involved in the election was allowed to advertise. Whether they did or did not was their own choice.
PS I do not support Southern or the JDA.
I simply do not understand the reference to “establishment media”
Well done FLG!
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Jersey politics is fiendishly complicated with three classes of members; Senators, Constables and Deputies with a variety of mandates elected from different bases.
Almost all of them are independents and manifestos range from the down right whimsical to the policy packed.
A lot of votes are cast on the basis of having been to the same school, attending the same church or some other bizarre reason.
This very personal style of politics was OK when Jersey was a small insular community but with a large and shifting population it is starting to break what are now very tenuous threads between the electorate and their representatives.
Another issue for the States to ignore!
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truthseeker 54…. I totally agree with you. Gerard Baudains was the best guy for the job who would have brought success and got to the bottom of things where needed and made change. The public have no clue what they have voted for in Le Gresley, and yes your right, he wont have a clue!
The ongoing nightmare continues for Jersey as most of the States members now dont have a clue.
A sad day has come for Jersey and our one beautiful Island will only grow worse and worse.
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That’s democracy ! (or at least for those who bothered to vote it is*)
Well done Mr. Le Gresley; a convincing(*) win !
I hope you do us proud and that you are not another Yes Man.
A very respectable 2nd. to Syvret – played a very honourable but a high risk game – and lost on this occasion.
Usually a 2nd would guarantee a seat -but not when there is only one seat available.
Perhaps not entirely a straight fight though:
http://www.thisisjersey.com/2010/06/14/more-than-a-political-sideshow/
The media sub text has been crystal clear for months but generally less blatant.
Good to have a diversity of functioning free press isn’t it ?
This way to the milking -I mean voting booths.
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Truthseeker #64
You are confused in your rage. Perhaps it is you who know how little your JDA politicians cause disruption and cost the working tax payer millions with their egotistical power hungry political antics.
You complain about the Chief and Treasury Ministers for not getting to grips with spending when I think you’ll find that it is champagne £44k a year socialists like Southern who are the very people voting for £10m follies we do not need on an island 9×5 and disrupting the cut back process. You complain about (and rightly so) a bloated public sector yet it was Southern who was backed and financed by a union that want the Island held to strike ransom so well paid States employees can continue to receive wage increases and job protection in a time when we face a deficit. You complain about hard working quiet politicians because they do not bleat rhetoric or waste Chamber time and money by calling for unnecessary and expensive investigations that have proved unfounded, or continue to slow the decision making process by causing continuous disruption in the chamber to satisfy their egotistical nature.
Please do not confuse Churchill with those you proclaim can prevent us sleepwalking into a crash. When have any of these misfits ever provided a working solution to the real financial problems we face?
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A majority of States members are honest, decent trustworthy people.
Sadly what they lack is any political vision or much reason for being there, basic skills like making speeches, asking or answering questions to Ministers.
Listen to the States for a few days or better read the Hansard account on the website and you begin to realise what a shambles it actually is.
Without a party system to provide experience for aspiring politicians, an effective speaker to control the debate or a Government and Opposition front bench, debates just meander on until members run out of things to say when a meaningful vote may be taken.
Listening to the incinerator debate was like listening to a slightly stuffy gentlemen’s club debating whether to have Eton Mess or Spotted Dick on the dessert menu, except the debate went on intermittently for fourteen years and the cost rose from £70M to £110M in that time.
But I suppose we have got the government we deserve…
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Pip Clement @74:
“A lot of votes are cast on the basis of having been to the same school, attending the same church or some other bizarre reason”.
And your evidence for this is…? Or is this yet another sour-grapes post? Personally I, and I suspect many others, voted for the candidate I thought would do the best job at representing me. I’m sorry yours didn’t get in. No, sorry, actually, I’m not; we call it democracy and for the first time in a long while we saw evidence that the rabble rousers are not in the majority. A candidate was elected who is honest and I think will do his utmost for the electorate.
Now, take a deep breath and together with “truthseeker” see if you can write one post with a single positive sentence. You never know, you might find it refreshing…
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Well done FLG
If the others were best for the job i.e. Baudains, why wasn’t he voted in?
We voted, Francis won – end of.
Get real all you saddos – go and do something positive instead of whinging on and on an on ….
Oh and did I say …”Well done FLG”
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No 24 you are so true.Having worked with Francis Le Gresley on many social issues ( sorry I worked and he talked !), he is politically aware,is totally one of the boys and so establishment.I presume he will now give his salary back to CAB and let some one else have a job.My biggest concern is the lack of any female candidates in the election.Ladies of Jersey get out there and go,girls go and get voted in.
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#76; That article link:
http://www.thisisjersey.com/2010/06/14/more-than-a-political-sideshow/
Nick (comment 14) and others hit the nail on the head with also some good posts by Davey West and Pip Clement and others.
View the article linked to in the light of Syvret coming 2nd !
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77.Joker…another one who can’t read it seems..Where pray do I mention the JDA….? and mentioned we had not one but two treasurers on full pay neither of whom seem to know what is in fact in said treasury………perhaps you should have gone to specsavers..truth is the armchair wallys who go for this sort of thing can not stand anyone with Grit in his Spit….till the stuff hits the fan then just as with Churchill they went running for him to protect them…pukemaking.
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to Truthseeker (64). I think you many find that when the brown matter you allude to hit the fan in 1939 Mr Churchill actually dumped us right in the aforementioned substance until 1945. He may well have been the very man we needed but unless I am mistaken think the Channel Islands suffered a world shortage of Winston until it was all over!!
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84 Nemo…no knowledge of history…?Winston was needed as Chamberlain was an apologist wet,in easy times some wishy washy so and so might seem o.k. but in fact can’t cut the mustard when the chips are down as at the moment they most certainly are. whilst it may have looked as though we were abandoned almost all citizens survived here as unpalatable as it was to be occupied,had the U.K. tried to defend us we would have been wiped out.your point may seem logical to you but is truly irrelevant.read your history before quoting it
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This island is supposed to be a democracy. If you didn’t vote, don;t complain about the result.
If you voted and your candidate lost, tough.
If you don’t like the guy who won – shut up – he won fair and square.
End of argument.
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62…. what an apt name..
put an apostrophe after the n in your surname and then add these endings to it…
really complain at who gets voted in
change anything if he doesn’t stand himself
change anything if he doesn’t vote
well done FLG
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I guess my little ironic joke won’t cut it then, at least not against your rapier like and historically incisive statement that “Chamberlain was wet” what a depth of knowledge you must have! Move over Simon Schama & 3/10 for the sense of humour!!! We have wandered way off the point and it’s getting boring! FLG has now been elected so that’s an end to it!
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I just wanted to say that i voted for Syvret. Yes some of his decision making and methodology has been poor but at the end of the day he was honest and did the right thing. I am not a fanatic or a crazy, all i want is a politician who does the right thing and thinks for himself, no one is perfect either.
It is a shame that he burnt a lot of his bridges in the past couple of years, but surely there is a reason why he has become so frustrated? Overall, the quality of the candidates was very poor. I congratulate FLG for getting in, i will judge him on his next 18 months.
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81. Cookiecrumble
Totally agree – a shame there was not a woman standing. That’s not to say they would have been the best candidate but it would be nice to see more women in the States.
I think the problem is that Politics has got very personal. I recall the outgoing tealady saying that disagreements in the States used to be left at the door and now they fester on (or something to that effect)
Women like to see a job done and the nature of personal attacks would probably put most women off standing.
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Truthseeker v Nemo # 84/85. It would have been a complete nonsense to have defended the Channel Islands and Churchill’s stance was the most pragmatic one.
The point is SS (was that the link with the Occupation?) is out and FLG is in – that’s the best thing for Jersey at this time.
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To Hugh Janus (60) Sadly it very often is the way that accused people need to prove their innocence but all I am saying is that I would like some answers or explanations to Mr Syvret’s accusations and comments.If he had accused me or a member of my family of some revolting crime I would be itching to have a very public “go” at him and I would be confident of showing him up for everyone to see.Why isn’t anyone doing this if all his talk is lies and fantasies?
I like comment 76 from Hedinda Sands by the way!
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Pip (65), this ere election wunt bout Baudains and Ryan, twas around Syvret n Southern, wunnit.
Why I am I talking like a St Mary’s tractor all of a sudden? Dunno.
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Truthseeker #83
If you’re anti ‘establishment’ and not for the JDA or SS are you telling me you’re a fence sitter?
Two Treasurers? Perhaps there is a legitimate reason for this, don’t let your imagination get the better of you, or are you party in information the rest do not have?
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Let’s make June 16 a bank holiday.
The day we were liberated from the SS.
A Jersey hating coward.
You’re not welcome in Trinity.
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Let’s see what the electorate think about Senator Le Gresley next year…..
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Julie # 92. Stuart Syvret has accused someone I know and this person is as pure as the driven snow. He knows the truth and just finds Syvret to an irksom little man who is infatuated by his own verbosity. My acquaintance has no need to prove his innocence as he has done nothing wrong.
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@ #95 What kind of coward would say a thing like that – and anon too?!
If you bothered to read his blog you’d see how much he loves Jersey. It’s just the corruption he hates.
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Once again the Jersey voter took the easy way out by voting for the ‘Nice Guy’. But, unless the ‘Nice Guy’ speaks quietly and carries a mighty Big Stick, he or she, like all ‘Nice guys’ will finish last!
FLG, is indeed, a thoroughly decent and likable human being and whether you voted for him or not, he deserves everyone’s respect. But FLG is faced with an enormous learning curve, one that if he doesn’t immediately get to grips with, will allow the Civil Service to eat him alive before he even gets started.
Gerard Baudins was the only experienced candidate to offer an objective course and plan of action to be taken over the remaining months before the next election – unfortunately no one heard or bothered to listen to him, As for the rest of the candidates, the election was no more than a pathetic turkey shoot, one that refused to deal with the question of how to reduce the size and administrative cost of Government.
Unfortunately, the people of this island no longer understand the difference between being Representativly Governed as opposed to being Ruled Over by an unelected and costly bureaucratic tyranny, which currently lies at the heart of the disgusting political and economic state in which we find ourselves!
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95 trinity hero…..You can not speak for Trinity as a whole or even in part…I often wonder if posters have one hand at the keyboard and a glass or so nearby when I read such Guff,,,many of us detest corruption,it does not translate to hatred of our island home at all, in fact the true Sons of Jersey are often willing to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune to fight for a fairer society.
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Hedinda Sands (76) I thoroughly agree with your comments at 76.
Also a big well done to Bean There (98) for your very apt response to trinity hero at 95. I found his/her comments truly offensive. They were obviously the words of someone totally ignorant of the facts.
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Some interesting comments posted. Of course Francis deserves congratulation – he won!
As it happens, I know him. He is a complete gentleman – but unfortunately has no idea what goes on in the States.
If he tries to oppose the Council of Ministers over anything, he’ll collapse under the abuse, personal insults and all the other nastiness the Council uses to suppress dissent. He’s too nice and will never take the strain – which means the obvious hole for him to hide in is as an assistant minister.
Afraid you’ve just voted for ‘more of the same’ folks – and with no-one there to press for a public service overhaul, just watch your taxes go up! Oh, I nearly forgot – that was about the only policy Francis had – raise Income Tax to 27 or 30%
A nice guy, but a sad day for Jersey.
The public must stop complaining about politicians – they are only there because the public put them there. If you don’t like what they do (or don’t do) why did you elect them? And it’s no good complaining that you didn’t know how they’d behave – if you can’t judge that, maybe you shouldn’t be voting.
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To answer some of the conspiracy theorists, having been asked by a number of candidates over the years to witness the counting process, I have never witnessed any improper practices. Again for the conspiracy theorists these have NOT been “Establishment” candidates. Spoilt papers are presented to the witnesses and normally consist of a blank paper or the person has crossed too many boxes. Any paper with a cross, tick or any mark making it apparent who the person was voting for are accepted. As strange and unfair as it seems to many of the commentators above, the winning candidate it always the person with the most votes. The process is called democracy. The profile of each candidate is made available through the media, hustings and their contact details are normally made available on their posters and banners. That so many are to lazy, ill informed or ignorant to vote is a sad reflection on our society, not the election process.
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The problem with our Government is simple in that we vote for the maverick who talks the talk and promises to ask awkward questions despite the lessons telling us that such candidates normally don’t have the experience or business acumen to understand the answers. We elect popular politicians who promise to increase spending and benefits whilst taxing somebody else.
During the election the question of States members pay was answered by most candidates by offering to “discount” their services even further. Politicians are like builders and the cheapest will normally turn out to the cowboy who will, when everything has gone wrong blame the person who built the house in the first place. We save a few thousand pounds in the wage bill of our elected representatives who then spend millions in hiring unaccountable civil servants to provide the governance and decision making abilities that they lack.
We currently have a government with the managerial ability comparable to their remuneration. In business a company is only as good as its board of Directors which is why investors tend to offer silly salaries to get the best. Whilst I don’t believe we should go that far I do believe that we need to up the quality of our States members and as employers we should be offering an appropriate remuneration to attract the best and unlike civil servants, we as voters get to hire and fire as we see fit.
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And so as the blind continue to lead the partially sighted…I concede the prophet is often not recognized in his own home town..perhaps the words of far greater men may catch your imagination..President Kennedy once said about a dinner he gave for Nobel Laureates that it was the greatest concentration of brain power ever gathered at The White house…Except for the times when Thomas Jefferson dined there alone.one of the most brilliant men ever warned that Democracy will cease when you take away from those who are willing to work hard,and give to those who won’t,and that it is incumbent on every generation to pay it’s own debts as it goes,a principle which if acted on would save one half of the worlds wars,most bad Government results from too much Government,and that to compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical,He said “We must not let our leaders load us with perpetual debt,we must choose between economy and liberty…or profusion and servitude,if we run into such debt as to be taxed on our meat and drink,on necessities as well as our comforts, in our labours and amusements for our calling and our creeds…we will have to work so hard as to have no time to think, no means of calling our mismanagers to account…but be glad to obtain subsistence by hiring ourselves to rivet their chains on the necks of our fellow sufferers,and this is the tendency of all governments…A departure in principle in one instance becomes a precedent for another(see any similarities yet)till the bulk of society is reduced to mere automatons of misery…and the forehorse of this frightful team…is public debt…Excessive taxation follows that…and in it’s wake wretchedness and final oppression..Let us resist it with all that is within us…Thomas Jefferson died in 1826 the language is a little dated but the content is as true now as then..A giant intellect and a man way ahead of his time…will we learn…? I hope so.
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Perhaps a way forward towards better government would be to approach the appointment of politicians in the same manner as a commercial enterprise would the appointment of staff. Each ballot paper would include an additional box that could be ticked in the event that the voter is of the opinion that none of the existing candidates have the skills or ability to properly manage the Island. Should enough people tick the “none of the above” box the election would be declared void. The salary for that seat would be significantly raised and new nominations called. As in the commercial sector the offer of higher salary would hopefully attract a higher calibre of candidates. In this way the politicians salaries would be set on the basis of commercial rational and the voter would only have himself to blame if he voted, and therefore appointed, a “lemon”. Unlike the current model where the decision making process is delegated to the Civil Service, a high calibre Government could take back the real decision making processes on behalf of the public. The public would have the opportunity to both “appoint” and ultimately “sack” any such “lemons” every 3 years without having to pay out millions in compensation as with Civil Servants. Whilst the election process would become somewhat drawn out and cumbersome it would bring control of the real decision making processes and the appointment of the key people in that process back to the people. A high calibre States executive of elected politicians would replace the current model where many hundreds of very highly paid, unelected, unaccountable and apparently un-sackable Civil Servants are employed.
To say that people should stand for politics for the “love” of their fellow man is naive and stupid. As has already been pointed out, anybody who wants to be a politician for the power alone is the wrong person to entrust such an appointment. They either have some personal agenda or belief they wish to legislate upon us or seek to gain some advantage for themselves or their business interests.
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I voted for you Francis Le Gresley on the basis that you will represent lower and middle income Jersey and that you will ensure that the upper crust pay their fair share of tax. I note that you have respect for Roy le Herissier, whom I believe would make a fabulous Chief Minister. Perhaps things ARE looking up!
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Brian Cant – I like your summary of the candidates, but you miss the point. You must always vote even if only to ensure that the “best” of those nine candidates get in – which fortunately happened on this occasion.
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yes mr facts
but my point is
if the role of states member appeals mainly to the inept, those who cannot work with others and those who are, frankly, stark raving bonkers
then
don’t we need to change the system?
The last truly “successful in the real world” person I can think of in the States was Geoffrey Grime. He had done well in the private sector, as part of a large organisation, and presumably wanted to use his experience and expertise to help the community. He lasted one term and left, frustrated. I assume at the fact that debates were conducted by those without knowledge or intelligence, and sensible change was impossible to make. The whole system is designed to prevent progress. It is a waste of time. And the quality of candidates reflect this.
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Non Voter #29. I did exactly the same as you 6 years ago after my name came up for jury service (before then I was unaware that this could happen). After sitting through an unpleasant case, it was not something that I wished to repeat. Therefore at the next opportunity I removed my name from the list and to this day I have not been back on.
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SH 110 and Non Voter #29
If you really don’t want to do Jury service why not volunteer for the honorary police.
As a serving police officer one can not sit on a jury, but one can still vote.
Also you are helping your parish.
Win Win Win.
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