1

mistershifter

Senator put your own house in order before shifting the burden of YOUR overspends, schoolboy errors and general balls-ups onto the long suffering tax payer. The first round of ‘suggestions’ were little more than a laughing stock and I guess that when you do hike up GST to 20% the excuse will be given that all options were explored. Pathetic.

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3

Pip Clement

So after softening us up with cuts that were not really cuts and some that will not get through the States eg cutting school milk, the Treasury Minister finally admits that taxes will rise by £50M, a sum very close to the savings the States are supposed to be making.
More slippery than a sandeel, Phillip Ozouf is obviously a graduate of the Peter Mandelson school of political dishonsety

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5

Bernard

All this happened on your watch. You pay for it!

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7

Matt Collins

Please, please, please tell me it April Fools day!!!!!! This man is a danger to Jersey, if the states stopped wasting money on non-essential things i.e States tea lady (can’t these highly paid politicans turn a kettle on i ask)

We are becoming a two class island where the rich get richer and the rest of us get taxed.

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9

david brown

matt(7) we are already, and have been since the first tax exile arrived.

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11

Judge Jeffries

No more taxes ! Enough is enough. The Treasury Minister must as a matter of urgency get his own house in order first e.g. pay reductions for the obscenely overpaid high ranking pen pushers,a moratorium on cushey consultant reports at £100k a throw,ensure that fiscal stimulus money actually stays in the island, get a grip on overspends and cock-ups, cut the number of politicians, better policing of income support and benefits, reduce business red tape, re-examine 1(1)K tax payments and directors’ outgoings………..

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13

Pip Clement

This will be another excellent showcase for the failure and muddle that characterises the States.
There is not a majority in the States for the government to command so getting tax rises may be almost as hard as the still to be implemented cuts.
My guess is that it will rumble on for years like the incinerator until the island faces disaster and then something will be done.

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15

truthseeker

How can Govt that does not know how to curb spending hope to be tenable…the financial report is a joke ,the treasurer,that is Mr Black, treasurer no 1…said he had no idea how much we had or where the money was going…so we are in a “We’ll just tax you more in case” mode knowing that we are leaking money everywhere with departments who have become rogue and unchallengeable…and why do we have now,two treasurers. one apparently on gardening leave.which seems to be developing into another John Day ,Graham Power Mr Christmas scenario…how long will we pay these people to do nothing….for those responsible for bringing these events to closure do not care as it’s not their money..it is in fact ours,so as we struggle to pay our taxes it is being blown on all these cock ups…Professional negligence is a phrase that comes to mind.

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17

Phil

This is only £2500 each pre the 20,000 tax paying Islanders representing only a 10% tax increase on the average take home pay of £25,000 which would therefore only increase basic rate tax to 30% plus GST and means that we don’t have to have any difficult conversations with the unions this year and can keep on wasting money until next year.

I keep repeating this fact and have been doing for well over a year. Unless we act now to CUT central services and our cost base and start to operate like a small town rather than a major economy the financial future of the island and the islanders is disastrous.

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19

jersey taxpayer

Well Senator Ozouf

1) For starters weed out the incompetent money wasting top civil servants and non-elected members of the Governement by cutting these obsene salaries that have just been published in the JEP.

2). Then spread the tax burden upwards to the upper crust whom Senator Le Sueur believes (and I quote) “it is immoral to increase the taxes of the wealthy”.

3)Then make a level playing field of 20% tax (which small local non-finance companies pay) across the board to all companies operating in the Island including finance and foreign companies who currently pay only 10% and 0% respectively.

4). Finally lift the cap on Social Security contributions.

Outcome: All black holes filled!

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21

Alan

Based on previous inaccurate budget figures etc where income has always been greater that that budgeted for, we should take PO’s figure of £50M with the proverbial pinch of salt. The abilty to overestimate figuresd year on year would I suspect mean that the true figure required could be anywhere between £0 and £20M

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23

God's Mentor

I know someone who has just started working for the States – £70K+ appointment. He has been asked to produced a detailed report – easily within his capability. No problem he thought. But what was he advised to do? Pay a consultant to write it. Utter madness!!!

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25

Cathy

Simon 4.

Some businesses are paying taxes – the local ones! Any profits are taxed on a percentage and for businesses looking at expanding, the profits cannot be re-invested without being taxed again!

i.e. If you own a hotel and make £50,000 profit, the tax system states that the company will have distributed 60% of its profits to the shareholders i.e. the family who own the hotel. Therefore even if you wish to re-invest you will have to pay 20% on £30,000. This will leave £20,000 for improvements etc. This is theory sounds fine but remember, if an English company own the hotel they will pay no tax in Jersey.

Jersey companies are now thinking hard about reinvestment and therefore the stimulus to the economy which normally occurs when an industry is having a strong year is being delayed whilst the current tax regime is in place.

Less money is filtering through the economy and the very businesses which are locally owned and often buy locally are trimming non essential spending.

Hopefully more States stimulus funding is available to repair more roads as it won’t be coming from local businesses

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27

cj

These states members are completely out of touch with us working people, they will want the shirts off our backs next. The reason these people are out of touch is because many are self made millionaires and others just inherited vast fortunes so don’t know the struggle the average person has with tax hikes etc.

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29

Toochin Cloff

Let the people speak. Why not get a petition together now which says the following:

We the people of Jersey, united in our belief demand as our right and power that the States of Jersey take the following action:-

1) Not increase taxes beyond their current level;

2) Decrease the vast sums of money spent on public services, top end public sector workers wages, and public sector employee pensions;

3) Increase tax on the banks rather than the people;

4) If the terms above are not met immediately, we the people of Jersey will strike on the streets, we will strike in the Workplace, we wil refuse to pay any increase in taxes.

If we could get 45,000 plus people to sign this petition we could force the States to take action

Who is with me?

WHO IS WITH ME?

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31

Davey West

On election day, the JEP tells us that,

Quote:-

ISLANDERS face a £50m tax hit in the coming years, Treasury Minister Philip Ozouf told a group of businessmen this morning.

Therefore,

The States have not put their house in order, but are willing to up taxes for islanders yet again. That is you and me having to pay out more, hence our quality of life will be affected, if you are low or middle class,you will be affected far more than the wealthy.

The good news is that in 18 months, you will want people in power who are NOT part of the establishment, whom at this time, are cutting costs by hitting front line people and service, plus extra stealth charges and cancelling a treatment pool,go private and pay they say.

The islander pays three times. Income tax,user pays and GST.

It is not looking good, how long will you be able to afford to live here? Maybe thats the hidden plan, developers want your house? only the very rich allowed.

As an opposition candidate Stuart Syvret had his faults, but cared for the people of Jersey and proved it.

Davey.

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33

70mill

Didn’t the states just say they received £70m more than they spent in 2009?! What are they doing with that?!

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35

truthseeker

30roger phlegm. what is your angle…?If companies do not pay tax here,they are NOT contributing….if a buisness is run here it ought to pay tax here….this ducking and diving is just another way of swindling….the practice needs to be outlawed…and lets’ have everyone on an even playing field…and charge the 10% corporation tax that we should have in the first place,may I remind the public that ordinary citizens in Monaco pay 0% tax..Mismanagement here abounds…just pick up the paper any day and there it is in all it’s unglorious splendour,sickening.

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37

Leah Holmes

#30 So let’s destroy all locally-run businesses and just replace them with ones owned by companies in other countries? Is that what the States want?

The local companies are here because this is their home, the other companies wouldn’t be here if it wasn’t financially beneficial to them as compared to operating from a base elsewhere! They’re here so chances are they are being taxed less here. Unless of course they’re idiots and are quite happy to pay more tax than they need to out of some duty to the people of Jersey? Somehow I doubt that’s their angle.

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39

Michael

Why doesn’t the JEP publish all these comments and show the states that the people are aware of what’s going on instead of just playing at reporting what the public feel by publishing a few letters. Who know they might even sell more papers if the public see their views are in the paper. People shouldn’t be force to have to give their name and address to get their message across as they may have very good reasons for staying anonymous

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41

Jasen K Cronin

The austerity programme is increasingly looking less like economics and more like a political project to restructure the states of jersey and roll back support for not just the poor and vulnerable but the services on which middle jersey depends upon. I may not be an economist, but nor is senator ozouf.

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43

The Jersey Bull

The Finance Minister, like all States Ministers, is no more than a ‘Messenger Boy’ for the overpaid and unaccountable Senior Officers who are setting States Policy for the Finance and other various States Departments – Ministers, from the top down, do no more than what what they’re told or instructed to do – and have absolutely no idea as to what is being spent or going on within their respective departments.

So now, the only recourse the public have left is to call upon the services of the Tooth Fairy, in hope that she will come and sort out the Stated Departments for us. Because the current Finance Minister, while engaged in nothing more than an exercise in narcissistic self-absorption, is far too busy serving the special interests of those who couldn’t give a damn about reducing the size and administrative costs of our government.

‘Democracy will cease to exist when you take [tax] away from those who are willing to work, and give to those [you name them] who would not’ – Thomas Jefferson

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45

Leah Holmes

No 44 You’re ignorant of the big picture, I’m certainly not ignorant of reality. What makes you think these people wouldn’t secure jobs and continue to work (I would if it was me)?

So no, I wasn’t suggesting they live off the gain, but that the gain is a lovely cushion that you wouldn’t have staying here in Jersey as inflation rises here also (or did you forget that bit of reality?)

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47

JULIE

To add to the debate between Leah and Realist!My husband and I left Jersey where neither of us worked in finance (not everyone does!)We are now well settled in a lovely location in England,both working in jobs we actually like and have the time and money to explore the country and travel further afield without that extra little piece of expensive water to worry about.Certainly a good move for us so I would have to agree with Leah as I can actually speak from experience.Depends what you want out of life really-we certainly do not miss the traffic,the so-called politicians and the lack of space.

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49

jackie

You wouldn’t pay 40% tax on your paltry earnings. In the U.K you can earn up to £34,700 plus a tax free allowance of £6,475 so you need an income of £41,175 before you pay 40%. You also only pay 40% on any income above the higher rate, not on your entire salary.

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51

Realist

49/50.
This discussion was about uprooting because of the potential for higher tax, which I argue is a shallow reason for leaving Jersey and doesn’t make much sense given the higher tax rates of other jurisdictions. Fiscally speaking, the rules for this strategy working is to have a relatively low income but a ton of equity in your house. I don’t know many people of working age in this position though I revert you to my earlier comments regarding stage of life and house value.

If all you’re talking about is quality of life in general being better in some places than others, well, stop the press and hold the front page. I left Jersey a long time ago for that very reason!

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53

Steve

The “black hole” was, for the most part, created by Le Sueur’s zero – ten policy. By now, he and the rest of the States must know that this policy is unacceptable to the EU and that he will be forced to reinstate corporation tax. Guernsey has alreadystated that it will be reitroducing corporation tax at 10%. None of Ozouf’s calculations appear to be factoring in the re-introduction of corporation tax at, let’s say, 10%. If this sham of a Government is allowed to proceed along these lines, no doubt guided by a Civil Service that is looking after its own interests, we will end up with a situation where the middle earners in Jersey will be taxed excessively, lower earners will pay less or nothing, high end earners will leave or make tax efficient arrangements and the inevitable re-introduction of corporation tax will generate a “windfall” of excess revenue which the States will then use to continue their policy of profligate spending.

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55

Leah Holmes

#46 Waow Realist, you really have no idea do you? Also, you seem to assume everyone in the island works in finance or something, thankfully we don’t all

And since when was my discussion about uprooting due to higher tax? I was thinking because of ridiculous property prices and the ability to have a cash cushion if you moved elsewhere!

Nothing wrong with my economic advice either, since in case you hadn’t noticed people are managing to live perfectly well in the UK (despite what the papers would have you believe). Anyone moving to the UK with a lump sum of cash as a cushion would be even better off!

#50 Sounds like you made a good choice, weird because by Realist’s narrowminded view of the situation you’d now be in poverty!

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57

Truth

Equality for all!

With the exception of those below the tax thresholds let us all pay 20%.

Earn £100,000, keep £80,000.
Earn £1,000,000 keep £800,000.
Where’s the problem?

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59

munchausenbyproxy

Truth – 57

earn £100,000 keep £80,000.

earn a million and keep £500,000 – who needs a million pound anyway? Do you need to eat gold sandwiches, buy expensive clothes and drive around in a car that does 200mph?

I say tax the rich, stabalise the medium, and release the poor. that is a fairer tax system than the 20 / 20 rubbish you spout.

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61

Leah Holmes

#60 Realist, again I wonder what you are on. Who says I don’t act on it? And how do you define whining? Everyone who is paying the States’ wages (which now excludes you I guess) has a right to object to tax rises when it seems most of that money will end up going down a big black hole!

Threads naturally change, if you can’t deal with it I don’t know why you come onto sites like this. In case you hadn’t noticed my comment about selling up was in response to #10, they changed the subject not me.

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63

Spartacus

let us take a long hard look at what the UK Government and nearly every other European Government is doing and having to do …..that is to make cuts ,not to services especially but to non essential matters.The UK are going to limit their excesses by cutting staff , they are looking to achieve 80% of their targets by cuts and only 20% by increased taxation,can we not do the same?
Lets start with WEB. It needs to be disbanded and revisited in perhaps 5 years time, when ,hopefully, this recession will be but a distant memory.
Jobs must go in the various WEB style quangoes , Heritage should not be given more money as it has proved by it,s purchase of the Duwks and its subsequent lack of use of them , as being incompetent and inefficient.
Spin doctors are not required , lets have some truth out there for a change.
ManPower resources is a joke department and should be disbanded.
Social Security and Tax should be merged achieving savings and less staff required.
11k Residents should be advised that as of say. Jan 1st 2012 , there will be no more special deals , that will give those of them that wish to leave, the opportunity to do so .
It is totally iniquitous that certain people should be taxed differently to others!
There are a million things Jersey could do to make more tax , such as an automatic deduction on interest earned at banks .
The immediate reversion to our old tax system achieving £100 million in gains , until such time as an agreeable method of going forward with the OECD is found.
Finally , nice as it is , free prescriptions should only be available to pensioners or those in need. Most of us can afford to pay a prescription fee.

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65

Pip Clement

“Yes we have some half pint lemonade shandy drinkers in the states but if you pay peanuts you get monkeys. No one of any worth is going to stand because the money is rubbish. So the ones standing are mostly egotistical.”

The fact that the States is basically a hot air factory that achieves very little might have something to do with it as well.
Casino debates for over a century, employement discrimination law still not implemented after thirty years, a town park and a police authority that have been discussed for over a decade but are still nowhere near to reality.
We are heading for our third attempt by the CoM at making WEB an island wide development company and the smart money has to be on the States throwing it out again.
£44,000 is enough to keep the wolf from the door and some members manage to run businesses or do other work part time as well so it is hardly penury. The fact that as a States member it is nearly impossible to achieve anything must be the most dispiriting part, I know a couple of ex members who say that their time in the house was a complete waste.

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