Budget amendment to take GST off food and heating
Tuesday 30th November 2010, 2:59PM GMT.
Treasury Minister Philip Ozouf
THE Treasury Minister has today lodged a last-minute amendment to the Budget which means that the States will now decide if GST should be taken off all food and domestic heating.
If accepted, the proposal would mean GST on everything else would double to six per cent to make up for the multi-million-pound shortfall the exemptions would leave.
On Saturday the JEP reported that Treasury Minister Philip Ozouf was considering bringing the amendment at the request of the Council of Ministers.
While Senator Ozouf has said he does not personally support the exemptions, he is now the only person who can bring amendments to the Budget with the debate only a week away.
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I would go along with this change of GST off food, I think its reasonable because I will just buy everything else apart food online.
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I don’t understand the point, take it off food and heating and double it on everything else.
I guess it would benefit those who only heat and eat.
Could be I’m having a senior moment, can someone explain the benefit.
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Are we supposed to be grateful for this?
It will mean 6% on fuel which will put up the price of food anyway.
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Lots of people I know have electric heating/oil filled radiators etc… so how will this work??
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Eye on chief ministers job!!
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Joined up thinking? No!
Your environment Minister wants us to be carbon friendly and use less fuel, not more. Lower GST on everything. Remove the school fee subsidies.
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i do hope the others take notice and remove this rotten tax on our food , the removal of tax on heating is a step in the right direction too.
just look who votes against this much needed amendment and remember.
i hear that goa in india is thinking about gst, but will have 100 exempt items, sadly i have not found out what they are yet.
they also have the no vote(non of the above )
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“Eye on chief ministers job!!”
I think that is in the bag already. He is Deputy Chief Minister and Treasury Minister, to be honest most of the current policy has his dabs all over it plus he will be the finance industry’s preferred man for the top spot.
He is safe in his seat until 2014 when the electorate might do a Portillo on him!
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I would rather have no GST on food and I am surprised people are still moaning, Father Xmas has arrived, well done Senator Ozouf!
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He’s forgetting to exempt diesel for rich boaties!
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Please, keep it simple and maintain a uniform rate.
Alternatively, go the UK VAT route – 20 % with exemptions while increasing Personal Tax Allowaces.
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About time. This should have been the case at the outset.
But I would make one amendment. Keep the GST on unhealthy food. If peoaple choose to eat rubbish then let them pay some tax. This could go someway to the health bill when they get diabetes, cholesterol, obesity problems.
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Why are we the only place in Europe that don,t get a pensioners allowance for heating?
UK get £250 a year £500 a couple while we get means tested.
In other words they want to know every aspect of our lives before they part with a penny.
UK folk who have moved to Spain or indeed jersey get the allowance as they have paid for it through SS while working.
Same as us we have paid all our lives and all we get is a measly bus pass.
Jersey one of the richest counties in the world would rather see the older generation go without than help them out!
In case you don’t know states of Jersey the older generation use more heating than the norm as they are home more,so therefore are filling up your coffers as you are the majority shareholder of electricity.
Most are on medication of some kind that thins the blood so therefore feel the cold more.
Have you ever woke up at night and put off going to the toilet as it is too cold to get out of bed?
Do you have to keep your heating at the minimum?
I think not.
We may get a higher pension than the UK,but the cost of living here is much higher,so therefore we are much worse off.
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Removal of GST on food will not reduce the price of food to what it should be. There would only be a slight reduction, if any.
The point is that shops selling food still have to pay GST on their rent, electricity, insurance and many other of their costs. Those put up the cost of what they sell by more than the apparent GST on the final sale.
When GST was introduced at “only” 3% I noticed that many prices had gone up by 10% or even more. If it had been removed then there would still have been the remaining 7% increase in prices. The same would apply to heating or anything else that might become “exempt”.
Most politicians think that they can fool most of the people for most of the time. The real danger is when they actually believe what they are saying.
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#5 Tony
He’s been lined up for this post for at least the past year or so. I don’t wish anyone harm but…..I hope he decides to emigrate or something.
What, if any, qualifications does Ozouf have which the rest of his pack seem to think are adequate? I am advised he has none!
I want full reimbursement for all the GST paid on food and heating.
Happy Christmas Ozouf. I hope Santa fills yours with a little common sense, and a massive load of education!!!
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#12 Good idea but I can’t see it happening. Given that the original objection to only having GST on some items was the cost and time involved in implementing such a system (not just for the States but for companies also) then I don’t see a system that will be far more complicated being introduced any time soon.
Anyway, I think we need to find some other way to tax obesity that doesn’t just cost those who eat healthily but enjoy the occasional treat. Maybe lower the cost of healthy food or healthy ingredients?
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I must admit to being slightly biased here as I do have oil fired central heating so would benefit from this amendment, and to be totally honest, if I can have GST free food and heating, I’ll be as happy as a pig in s**t!
Everything else, when seen in context, are effectively luxuries and if GST must be paid (which it must because our esteemed leaders can’t keep their hands out of the public purse!) then I could live with that.
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Does this mean that the GST compensation payment will be scrapped for the low paid and those on welfare? I would rather have my bonus because prices won’t go down.
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Starting to wobble me thinks. 2014 will be here before you know it.
Anne I would be interested to know what he is qualified in.
I will be happy to see him deselected in 2014, as will others judging from what I am hearing. GST has upset a lot of people.
What hopefully will be the icing on the cake is the U turn he has made from his election pledge.
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The great “dictatorship” that we live under is quite ridiculous.Its quite baffling that they seem to invent “imaginary” taxes to put on top of existing taxes to scheme us out of more money.
Im currently being quoted almost £400 for a certificate to import a car that they wouldnt ask for anywhere else including the uk.
That on top of GST and some emmissions duty plus some other tax its insane!
Bella claims that Jerseys one of the richest
“counties” in the world?? “Countie”???
or did you mean country? I didnt know Jersey was a Countie a Country or rich for that matter.
I thought Jersey was bankrupt? and hasnt been rich since Bergerac buggered off,Murray Norton stopped appearing on Radio 1 and the fag burned Defender machine was removed from St Peters bars.
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Why make everything more complicated? The time to have done this was a couple of years ago,not now and especially if other items have to increase in cost as a result.
How on earth will small businesses manage?? I wouldn’t like to own a corner shop now, GST on batteries, not on biscuits, GST on flowers and the JEP, not on jam and chutney.
My brain is aching already!!
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then no one will need a GST refund – if not on food and heating then also take it off school clothes, books etc then if on welfare you’ll be adding to the pot for once instead of taking!less admin for welfare win win
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I’ve lost track of how many times the States have had this same discussion – at least they won’t have to spend time writing fresh speeches.
Exemptions make tax-collection more expensive, and require more manpower (for businesses as well as for government); they provide completely non-targeted financial assistance, while reducing the pot available for targeted assistance; and they give rise to a host of terminological arguments: Are crisps, Quavers, and peanuts ‘food’? What about biscuits, cakes, chocolates, diet supplements, soft drinks, bottled water, coffee beans, edible flowers, restaurant meals, etc, etc?
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Bella (comment 13)Whilst I consider myself much better off financially since moving to the UK I must correct you on one point. The winter fuel payment is £250 per household and not doubled up for a couple.I am not old enough to qualify thankfully! but will be very grateful for it when I do!!I think it is £400 when you are over 80 by the way.
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Put the extra GST on everything.
The more you got, the more you can spend, the more tax you pay.
Means test for those who can’t afford to live, thereby leaving more in the pot for those genuinely in need.
Raise GST to 12% for all purchases from M&S, anyone who shops there can afford it.
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Yeah you are probably right Julie.
My sister-in law is divorced and they both get £250.
12 grateful fool.
Are you encouraging them to have more control on what we eat?
Don’t you think we are quite capable of making our own minds up without interference from the state?
They are already snooping enough in our private lives without dictating what we can and cannot do,all under the pretence of elf and safety.
How do you tell the difference between junk food and good food?
All food is junk IMO all has been messed about with additives and all sorts of preservatives,es,antibiotics etc,so unless you grown your own you can’t avoid it.
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country county what does it matter.
Another smart alec with nothing better to do!
Wise people speak because they have something to say,fools because they have to say something!
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I do not believe that the zero rating of food and heating oil will lead to a reduction of the current prices. It will almost certainly mean that existing prices are maintained by retailers and distributors, so there will be no net benefit to the final consumer from any move to zero rating, while the doubling of GST for other items will result in all being worse off.
The implementation of GST was poorly thought through from the beginning.
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I think the States could go for this.
It would be a good flak handling strategy and November 2011 is already beginning to concentrate minds on electoral survival.
Also by creating an exemption category it would make a move to 8 or 10% easier in 2012 or 2013.
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I agree with Keyser (28)
If businesses have to go through the additional expense of changing their tills (again) and the extra work required to collect and pay the tax, they are not going to lower prices if they don’t have to.
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BELLA
well said Bella you tell him, who does he think he is correcting you, i bet he had a private education subsidised by pensioners,thats where your subsidy went and not on keeping you warm !!!
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#27
Spot-on, Bella! The spelling police are pathetic
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31# NOAH
Thanks for that,they dont come very often.
Too many on this site like that who think they are so superior,have little or no real comments to add and pull up others over simple errors.
Mind you I do call a spade a spade and shoot myself in the foot.
Thanks again.
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This could be a vote winning tactic by Ozouf. He brings the proposition (even though he very publicly doesn’t agree with it) in order to appear fair and impartial.
Meanwhile, it is very possible that he may already be secure in the knowledge that the proposition won’t be passed. Any such knowledge will come from an insight into how his allies in the house will vote if, as is the case, it is already known that he, as “minister” is against the proposition. Besides that, he may already have taken an informal sounding which will give him the required security.
This may, therefore, turn out to be a time-wasting tactic which is all about ensuring “votes for Philip” at the forthcoming election and which has nothing, as usual, to do with the ordinary person who is feeling the pinch due to the historic damage wreaked by the Senator and his cronies.
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Jersey is an island Bella! Their i have spelt it out for you.Also empty vessels make the most noise
and you “certainly” have plenty to shout about.
Fools spend their time responding to every comment like an erant child in a playground.
Fools should know their place,and not open their mouths and prove themselves more foolish.
My point will be proven with yet another dim witted response i fear.
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* 35 There’s another one who feels compelled to respond to everything. Sometimes he does it timeously, other times, he stores up his gripe and does it “en bloc”, providing reference numbers to all the various commentators who have disagreed with his righteous viewpoint. I would guess that these people don’t have jobs to go to……
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Bella, I think we all knew what you meant by ‘county’ or ‘country’, it was never a problem. It is somewhat amusing that Uncle at #35 who pulled you up for it is not aware of the correct usage of ‘their’ or ‘there’ – dear me, will some people never learn to keep quiet
PS errant – with two ‘r’
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not to mention the incorrect use of the comma
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plus the numerous other mistakes in his original post – lol
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Their was i foolishly thinking i wasnt being spied on by one of Putins puppets.
How telling the truth can get you into trouble and having a point of view can “upset” so many people.Would it be a “crime” to not have a job because one was financially comfortable enough not to need one?
Or can i assume that certain individuals are writing on blogs instead of doing their job;-)
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UT=RT
Jersey is in a mess and Ozouf ad co are stumbling from crisis to crisis now.
A downward spiral has been commenced, fasten your seat belts and await the inevitable.
We’re going downhill and we’re going fast…..
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Are swimming pool repairs and yacht services still exempted?!
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Remove GST from shipping and the transport of goods, from source to this island. Shipping from the UK is a neccesity and does not add value.We are already charged the VAT inclusive price in certain well known UK high street retailers in Jersey. The excuse is that the shipping costs justify this. Imagine another 6% GST on top and our retail outlets will have the most expensive UK high street goods in the British Isles.
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Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
Obviously the “genius” that is pot & kettle has never heard of a full stop lol.
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And there’s me thinking Jersey is a continent!!!
Don’t cry for me cause I,m a fool as the song goes.
I never look for errors in comments as some put them in on purpose to throw us off the scent.
My ma told me if you can’t say anything nice to any-one,don’t say anything at all.
Getting back to the point Jersey is one of the riches PLACES in the world so they keep telling us,and if they have been squandering the money,that’s their problem not ours.
Why should we go without to appease them.
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My gut feeling is Mr Ozouf figures just don’t add up. Most of my weekly spend on things bought in shops is food. So taking GST off food, would need GST on other items to be more than 6%.
If the higher GST is imposed on local shops then even more people will buy on-line. Therefore reducing the local GST tax take. Which in turn the States will have to increase GST. And a vicious cicle will take place until nearly every shop is out of buisness and those left will have GST of 20%+.
MADNESS.
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bella yes Jersey is on of the richest places on earth but most of that wealth is held by the few. The rest get a crumb and then get a large part of their crumb taken away under the guise of a variety of taxes…they then get told how lucky they are to get part of a crumb.
matt when GST reaches 20%, I would make that 40% as you forgot the VAT which masquerades as import costs!
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Well said Adrian, to the rest of the world we are all millionaires living it up in Paradise but the reality is there’s a very small percentage enjoying the Jersey Millionaires Club whilst the rest of us struggle.
Uncle Tadeusz – grow the hell up, at least Bella had something relevant to say, whether or not we agree is immaterial. Yeah yeah county countie country w/e. Not read anything even remotely debatable yet by yourself, unless one wants to argue the worth of the Defender machine in St Peters Bars?
Personally I preferred “Mr Do” (the one where you grab the apples and dig like crazy to get away from the Fruit Monsters) although it got incredibly *Frustrating* around level 14.
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42 Tom Jones…yacht fuel gets off with it…..now how does that empower the poor financially….?
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@49 Truthseeker
I recall watching a “news” report from the Donkey Isle where “they” had wheeled out the token sacrificial pawn to justify why fuel for boat owners should remain tax free.
And it is said that there isn’t enough humour on TV nowadays:-)
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Comments 47&48 are bang on the money.
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All huff and bluster as usual.
The problem with Jersey is that too many people concentrate on what divides people, and not enough people have practical ideas.
To say “tax the rich” is fine, but what does that mean: income tax, capital taxes, something else?
If income tax, at what level do you apply a higher rate: 30% for £50,000 plus? £100,000 plus? At what figure do you need to set the rate and the threshold to bring in a material additional amount?
There aren’t that many high earners and most could structure things so that their income is reduced: for example, partners at law firms or owners of fund management companies could accept a salary linkd to the 20% threshold and “roll-up” profits into a structure that pays a one off capital sum on retirement.
Deemed distribution is already on the way out as being unacceptable so how do you stop someone rolling up profits in a corporation which are then sold for a capital sum to new partners/owners?
If capital taxes, how do you introduce them without scaring away wealthy people who have retired here and without closing the finance industry? Again, you cannot impose capital transactions just on locals and if you imposed them on users of the finance industry it would close the business overnight.
My point is fairly simple: tax is a complicated matter and it isn’t enough to say “tax the rich” unless you have specific proposals and have really thought them through.
And here’s a curveball. A lot of people say GST shouldn’t be on essentials like food and fuel. Why not? After all, the idea is that taxes pay for essentials such as healthcare and infrastructure. Why should we only finance essenial services from non-essential expenditure?
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A note of caution, be carefull what you wish for. If GST is taken off of food and fuel it will surely follow that GST will rise out of control. The only thing to keep them in the “Big House” in line is the tax on food. Ozouf will lap this up whilst trying to keep the tax on everything
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I along with many others heard him on the radio..sanctimonious drivel…saying that food and fuel ought not be exempted…..they are unless you are rich daily needs….Tax on boat fuel..recreational….and it is no longer excusable to hold off on Capital gains tax..those who make big bucks on property sales must be made to pay their whack. the well off are asking for social unrest and trouble by taking the P**s out of the ordinary grafters.
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truthseeker,
you say “it is no longer excusable to hold off on cgt”.
Can you explain how you would introduce CGT, what thresholds you would apply, and how you would apply it to the finance industry in a way that is EU tax compliant?
Otherwise your comment is about as much use as those who ay “the states should cut spending by 50%” without saying what they should actually cut.
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It is a cruel tax thsat effects the most vulnerable and it stifles business.
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Don’t think for a minute that the shops will actually reduce their prices if the tax does come off.
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55 who said anything about the finance industry..? Looks like yet another troll type comment.I,m not here to educate you Pond
A tax on house sales.same a a tax on anything else.
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Looking at applying income tax to all at 20% of income however derived would be a start. Give all a tax free survival level say £15-20,000. Then above that 20% on all remaining monies, not like some who pay 1% or less on large sums.
That would make things more equitable and be seen as fair by the vast majority.
I define a rich person as someone who can take advantage of tax avoidance measures not available to the majority.
One way would be to put fuel duty on boat fuel for leisure craft. Big boats tend to use a lot of fuel and tend to be owned by you know who.
As per GST it is regressive as it hits the poorer in society the most. The rich spend but a fraction of their disposable income on day to day living, unlike the majority who spend it all. They therefore benefit to a larger degree to a poorer person by paying GST, as opposed to paying 20% of income like the majority.
As per rolling things up, if everyone availed themselves of this not much tax would be paid, would it?
Anyway what some seem to overlooked is that in times of depression one doesn’t shut down spending in an economy, as it could drive it further down the slipper slope to a great depression. This is basic economics. However people like Ozouf and co seem unaware of this.
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Now the wizard of Oz has been got out breaking his own manifesto, what will he do about his morally corrupt Zero ten taxation, this was a free-bee to the finance sector, will he pass this on to middle Jersey…you bet he will. But he will spin it to make us think he is doing us a favour and half of the commentators on here will believe it.
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