Did they know what they were signing?
Tuesday 25th January 2011, 3:00PM GMT.

Ted Vibert with the petition signed by more than 10,000 people
ISLANDERS who signed the ‘sack Ozouf’ petition have complained to the JEP that they were tricked by the Jersey Democratic Alliance who told them the petition was against the GST rise.
Yesterday the JDA announced that they had gained more than 10,000 signatures for their petition – but concerns have been raised from some of the signatories who were told it was about fighting the GST rise to 5% that takes place from June, not about getting rid of the Treasury Minister.
Three Islanders have called the JEP to complain since concerns were first raised yesterday.
• Read the full report in today’s JEP
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I signed it and would again in the future.
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Whose nose is growing now Ted?
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Oh dear – is this really a headline story?
Three people out of 10,000 who were ‘duped’. You know what they say, always check the small print.
If I had been in St Helier on a Saturday I would willingly have signed on the strength of both proposals!
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THREE people have called the JEP. Wow.
Perhaps they should have READ the form – it was clearly stated what the petition was for.
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How dim!
When you sign you sign, just as when you vote you vote, get it wrong you only have yourself to blame.
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I signed a petition to stop the GST rise….
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DO NOT TRUST THE JDA THEN!
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I have just read the JEP and am sure that there are many others who have signed the JDA petition believing that they were only appealing against GST increases and were unaware of the deeper issue involved of getting rid of a politician. They say you should always read the small print and I shall certainly think twice before signing another petition. It’s a shame because this must undermine the impact of the real reason people signed the petition. The cost of living in Jersey is high enough already and the GST increases must surely increase the gap between the rich and poor in the island.
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O Dear O Dear !
“Sack Ozouf’
Should have read what you were signing don’t moan now or try to say you were tricked, once again I expect its was only a couple of people who complained and all the rest were happy.
“Ozouf done his time it now time to let some one else have a go”
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When I saw him in town on the Saturday with his petition, Mr Vibert was wearing large sandwich boards upon which in very large letters was written “Sack Ozouf for lying about GST” or something very similar. I fail to see how anyone could be unaware of what the petition was all about.
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I signed because I was informed that it was against the rise in GST. I was not duped – I was lied to.
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i signed it, but as per usual, i do not expect it to make any difference.
with or without ozouf the public would still be ignored, unless it is election time.
still gst on food stinks.
tax electricals , cars and other items.
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Saying sorry might help. Shame they keep messing it up, as they are right with GST, and a number of other issues.
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wonder who planted them ?
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I signed and it was explained what the petition was for .
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I too signed this petition and thought it was to vote against GST I would NOT have signed it to oust P Ozouf and help wiht this so called witch hunt!
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Yes we all knew, except Ozouf supporters…..why am I not surprised.
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I wonder who the three people were who phoned the JEP…………….hhhmmmmmmmm let me think………. and even the fact that it has been reported as such in the JEP, surely means that it is fact?????????????
Ok even without the three dopes………..oooopps did I say that….. I mean the 3 people who felt “duped” – thats 9,997 people who by any stretch of the imagination, is an over whelming reflection of the general public’s opinion.
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There is a strong allergy to the will of the people any place where power is held that dissadvantages the population..we have had petititions on the flooding of Queens Valley.GST itself ..now an increase…always the establishment clones will try to suppress or rubbish the truth ..all well known and transparent strategies…..fact is people are struggling here,and the pain has been caused by those in power allowing the mushrooming of the civil service it’s overpaid executives and staff,along with massive public spending.much of which has been spawned by the aforementioned civil service in order to create the illusion that we need them in such vast droves as they wander like herds of wilderbeests Hither and yon,Yet the Parishes are in the black.and always have been..spot the difference in modus operandi…yes you have it,thousands and thousands less staff walking about clipboards under arm trying to look busy as they pick up their dry cleaning and a Costa plenty coffee…That is the real problem that Jersey has, and until the money runs out or some politicos with the cajones will grasp the nettle and take it on and do the right pruning, we are screwed.
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Was it really another slow news day?
The petition is not legally binding,just a reflection of the apathy and discontent the general public feel.
They took no notice of the GST petition,so why are the powers that be including the JEP so worked up about this?
I sense some panic is setting in as he Elections are drawing in.
To much space given over to this Senatorial reduction as well.
It was Democractically voted in,or do they only subscribe to the Democracy thing when it fits in with their version of Democracy?
Amazing who they bring out the woodwork,when they feel threatened.seems to be a case of panic setting in.
Jep editorial comment as well, the pressure is definately on.
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If the this story is true…I signed the petition in Good faith believing, it was opposing the increase in GST! Or I wouldn’t have signed it….Lesson learnt…read the small print and none of those manipulators will ever get a vote from me….appalling behaviour
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I signed the petition, didnt realise it was also about sacking Phil Ozouph until just before signing it and someone was saying they would sign if it was only about GST and not also the sacking.
So, i realised in time and still signed it. For me it still shows people are against the GST element so if people feel duped the JDA should persist with the GST part and forget the sacking bit as without it they may have got more signatures.
The bit that people are not saying is imagine if the 11ks were told they were going to have to pay a relative amount of tax to their wealth there would have been less than 10000 signatures but they would have been listened to and probably had things sorted out in their favour. Oh, hold on they dont need to petition because thats a forgone conclusion!
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I was in town and they asked me to sign, hay said it was against the rise in gst so diddthe banners they had.
But I did not sign it as I think gst should go up, but only if they force all shops to remove the uk vat as well. In fact make gst fixed at 10% if local shots stop charging both.
The rents in jersey are still way less than central London!!
The guy from JDA seemed very argumentative and was not prepared to listen to other props opinion, jut wish I had realised what the petition was for as I would have made a banner up exposing this sham of a group.
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truthseeker what on earth are you rabbiting on about. It has nothing at all to do with apathy, this has to do with the JDA misleading people.
Get a grip, and face the facts – Jersey’s unemployment is declining, and financially we are in a strong position relative to most places.
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The signs I saw last week by the petition signing desk, last week, were about GST and had no mention of Ozouf !!!
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the moral of this story …don’t sign things without reading them first … and don’t blame someone else for your mistake…the signature came from your hand…noone else did it for you
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Ted was very clear in what you were about to sign.
GET OZOUF OUT! HE LIED ABOUT GST AND CONTINUES TO DO SO.
Well done Ted for trying.
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Since reading the article in the JEP I have spoken to a number of people who signed the petition beleiving it was to say they were against the increase in GST. Indeed many people who did not sign heard the JDA members in St Helier town centre and St Brelade saying that it was a petition to scrap the increase.
Sorry JDA you’ve lost all credibility!
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Crikey,pot kettle and black or what…? it is alleged that 3 peeps did not read the paper or had not had it pointed out…Ozouf openly lied about GST.it is well documented…the crowing about 3 peeps is in fact a ploy and is factually irrelevant really…there are those out there who are terrified by the truth…and worried that vested interests are being threatened by…wait for it….Democracy…!!now Mr Vibert you must have learned by now that the jersey way is fearful of honesty and openness,what do you think you are up to trying to stave off another increase in taxes that the elite and their lap dogs can squander on more designer bollards for instance..or wrecking the beautiful Victorian walkway at La Collette, or commissioning reports and hiring more experts..vomiting out our money in a constant gusher of irresponsibility and secrecy as the brown envelopes change hands at the golf course..you’ve been seen don’t cry about it.we know what goes on. so Mr.Ted you have not apparently been bought.Life is funny.
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Here we go again – When are Jersey folk finnaly going to realise that Ted and his commie cronies in the JDA are unsuitable for government
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Every time I walked past these fools they were conning what looked like 14-15 year old girls into signing. I’d be interested to see what proportion of the electorate actually gave into the pleas of an ex-’politician’
Trying to engage him in debate was akin to hearing an A level student regurgitate Marx.. abject tedium ensues.
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This “headline” and the comments above prove exactly why a petition to sack a politician (carried out in this manner) should be ignored. The actual motivation of someone who signed may be more complex than a signature either “for” or “against” a politician, that is to say someone may have signed as they were against a policy (such as a GST increase) rather than being against the actual politician who decided on the policy. There is a subtle difference. However, the petition may have been seen as the best way to voice their policy concerns.
The “Sack Ozouf for lying about GST” sandwich boards are a clear example of the apparently democratic JDA appealing to those against GST (but not necessarily against Ozouf) in order to boost the number of signatures on petition. This is not democratic, merely a blatant appeal to populism. The JDA’s credibilty as a political alternative would be better maintained if it succeeded in living up to its “democratic” name.
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The content of the petition was perfectly clear.
GET OZOUF OUT.
Comments on here are only the Ozouf squad trying to discredit an opposition party. How do we know that these people complaining weren’t actually signing it so they could discredit it later?
I don’t particularly agree with the JDA policies but in this case they are right.
Ozouf is a liability and has cost Jersey millions. And before anybody forgets we are the ones paying for it.
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I have recently twice had to run the gauntlet of – sign the petition “against GST increase” (or as it is now known the sack Ozouf petition). Has anyone else thought I might as well sign this to get away from these very intimidating supporters of this petition? I personally believe that the only way forward for us to balance the books is this increase in GST; I accept that others have their own views. Do we have to be accosted in such an aggressive way, can’t we be left with our own views and a polite no thank you be enough from either side. How many of the people who signed the petition wished they could just use the ballot box.
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The Ozouf government and its media are clearly very worried that the Jersey public are putting up such resistance to the unfair imposition of taxes like GST. Whilst corporations are paying nothing, the middle classes face 20 means 20, and everyone faces GST rises. How can this be fair? There is income tax for the gullible but no corporation tax. How stupid does Ozouf think we are!
The petition is like a 10,000 lb bomb that has just fallen through the roof of Cyril Le Marquand House and into the middle of the Minister’s sandwiches. It’s ticking. If it explodes that’s 10,000 VOTES across the island and a lot of casualties amongst GST supporters in the October elections. No wonder Ozouf is panicking.
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I think this story is a direct result of comments made on this forum by regular contributers, do we get a percentage?
As I said when responding to the original story I didn’t sign but neither was it made clear to me that sacking Ozeuf was a part of the petition.
I do hope this discredits the JDA, we are currently up a famous 4 letter creek sans paddle and need to take action, whether that action is implementation of a GST increase is debatable but something needs to be done other than complain.
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I signed this before the meeting at Fort Regent, only to find when the rally started that it was nothing to do with GST. I walked out of the meeting, which spent 2 hours slating Ozouf, and went on about how states workers are hard done by and don’t get enough sick pay, pensions and time off. I work for myself and get none of this, and can’t stand people bleating on about conditions. I asked Ted Vibert to remove my name from the petition. Ted Vibert and Geoff Southern are a disgrace to politics, and their campaign was definately a fraud. I saw them in town shouting only about GST, no mention at all about the real reason.
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Absolute Joke. I didn’t sign, but I was approached a number of times by quite aggressive petition organisers. I was very clear told to sign to stop rise in GST. I said I thought this was the fairest form of tax rise and so didn’t want to sign. The man got really angry and said something about “its people like you that have no idea and cause the Island’s problems”.
This happened on more than one occasion.
Also, the fact that kids and tourists were actively being asked to sign makes me even more frustrated
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Its amazing and actually amusing how the young charismatic Ozouf now has a pair of over middle aged lefties duping the public with phoney petitions in a desperate attempt to belittle his already majority States approved tax changes.
Why don’t they just accept defeat for a change because this Treasury Minister is far more smarter than they will ever be and the public see it time and time again.
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I actually asked Ted if he was successful – what did he intend to do to replace the shortfall – the reply was a garbled rubbish about taxing the rich – the man is a joke – the JDA is a joke but thay are dangerous because they have no ethics and will say anything to get a vote -
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If you strip out the people who signed this under duress, those who were misled into signing it,the children who signed it, the non-residents who signed it and the people who signed it many times using different names, only a few hundred seperate people who are entitled to vote in Jersey probably signed it.
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I was one of those who was conned. Mr Vibert came over to me with a blue biro claiming that it had run out of ink. He said his hands were too cold to use it properly and asked whether I would scribble on a piece of paper to see if it worked.
I did and the pen worked. Only afterwards did I look down and realise that I had actually signed a death warrant for the Treasury Minister.
I immediately went to scrub out my signature but by then Vibert had tugged on a string, started the rocket pack concealed beneath his KILL OZOUF sandwich board, and had zoomed several hundred feet above me, cackling maniacly as he went.
Damn you JDA. Damn you.
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What difference does it make?
There is obviously 10 000 unhappy people.
Would you have kept Adolf Hitler in the German government after the 2nd world war with his brilliant ideas ???
Everybody knew that it would start at 3% and go up and up…and up … and up but nobody knew how soon.
At least someone is doing something about it
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Mondieu@31,
14 and 15 year old being asked to sign a petition against something that affects them.
these youngsters are the generation who will have to try and sort out the mistakes that we have allowed our government to make.
.
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I also assumed and wrongly, and I take full responsibility for that, that the petition was against GST. However, if I had realised that it was to get rid of Ozouf who is driving the Island to it’s knees I would have joined the JDA and encouraged others to sign. If this were a democratic government there would have already been a vote of no confidence in the Minister, but that’s boy’s clubs for you!
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I signed the petition thinking it was for the rise in GST too.
I wouldn’t have signed it if it were for sacking Ozouf!
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Fiver says Vibert and Southern won’t apologise for this.
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BLADE – I can assure you that my 13 year old step daughter did not sign the petition because she wished to discredit the thing. She and her friends did so because they were cajoled by JDA “grown ups” to do so.
Please do vote against Ozouf in the Election if you wish to, it is your right. But it is not your right or that of the JDA to claim that 10,000 signatures on pieces of paper mean that the majority of Jersey folk want the same as you. Whether that is the case remains to be seen, it’s what elections are for – the point here is that the JDA have been shown to be less than truthful, shall we say.
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They did this on the town park petition aswell.
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Often petitions are subliminally more significant than the actual aspect they claim to be petitioning. They can be seen as a symbol of general discontent and registration of ones protest against acting authority. The vehicle “topic” is often less significant than the act of attributing ones name to a registry of discontent. Is it not more significant that over 10% of the population registered discontent?
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Yes, everytime i passed the petition stand in King Street i heard Ted Vibert shouting about GST, nothing about Ozouf at all. And what has Ted Vibert ever achieved for the people of Jersey? All he does is aggressively attack other people and actively promote himself, which is also what this saga has been about….jump on the anti-GST bandwagon to get elected this autumn. And of course, he’s very keen i’m sure to get elected to have a nice 40K + annual income coming in. I’m genuinely surprised Southern hasn’t distanced himself from this loser, but maybe Southern is as bad.
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This is a disgrace. I signed the petition against GST and nothing more so yes maybe I should have asked to see the top of the petition but did not even consider that this was one of the JDA’s clever little dupes. Shame on you.
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I signed it. It was very clear what the petition was for. Those Ozouf cheerleaders who say it wasn’t clear must be blind because the posters behind the table made it plain and simple.
However, if they wanted to scrap the petition and do it again with neon lights calling for Ozouf to be sacked I would sign it again in a heartbeat.
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47. Mike
http ://www .thisisjersey. com /2011/01/26/duped-names-will-be-removed-from- sack-ozouf-petition/#comment-92221
I’ll be having that £5 please!
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I would prefer the votors to decide our states members, NOT the JDA. This petition changed from being against the rise in GST to a personal attack on a democratically elected states member.
The only JDA member in the states ( Southern) failed in his attempt to get elected as a senator
Rabble rousing and extremeism does not add up to good goverment.
I will never vote for JDA as they are not honest.
Jerseyman
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If you dont want an increase in GST then you would be naive to still want Philip Ozouf as our Treasury Minister. He is Mr GST.
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What a waste of time people have spent signing this or any petition, no one takes any notice of them , i imagine that when this petition has been handed over, within the hour it will be in a bin. More fuel for the new incinerator.
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Isn’t it time we were told the truth about Ted? I mean, he was a senator, then he packs in mid term, goes quiet for a few years then starts launching petitions every few weeks and indicates he is going to run for senator again. Surely we are owed an explanation of why he couldn’t hack it first time around?
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Removal of Senators…did they know what they were voting on.?
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Three people Wow ! – and it’s front page headlines in the JEP !
Is it another slow news day – or is there a bit of opinion management going on here ?
This compares to the mere ~7 column inches given to “Questions over removed clauses in police report” which was hiding on page 4 of the JEP of Friday 21 Jan 2011 and the complete absence of the story from this website/comment pages.
Apparently the agreed/circulated terms pf reference for the Napier report included “to review all relevant information relating to the original suspension including relevant parts of the former police Chief’s published affidavit”. This last minute & secret* removal is perhaps as telling as the shenanigans which were to be investigated (or in fact NOT investigated as it turned out !!!)
(*secret until the report was completed – “Fait Accompli”)
At least the petition was presumably written down in black and white – Perhaps people who can’t be bothered to read (or just can’t?) should avoid signing petitions ? – Don’t count anyone who signed with an X or a thumbprint!
At election time – we vote – largely on the basis of believing what we are told -there is a lot of deceit in politics -poor us.
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Katie K
“If the this story is true…I signed the petition in Good faith believing, it was opposing the increase in GST! Or I wouldn’t have signed it….Lesson learnt…read the small print and none of those manipulators will ever get a vote from me….appalling behaviour”
How big do you need the print the sandwich board was BIG enough!!!!!!!
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The GST will go up anyway, Ozuf will stay… What’s the big deal? I’m just sorry for poor trees wasted for all those sheets of paper. And you naive thinking you can change something by signing a piece of paper… poor you.
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Agreed no 58.
It would also be interesting to know what he did in Australia (where he chose to spend most of his working life)
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“It would also be interesting to know what he did in Australia (where he chose to spend most of his working life)”
We could even see if they want him back.
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Tony 61….It’s not a case of Sandwich Boards!!! .. Big ones!!!… As you have taken the trouble to add your meaningless observation …it was the blatant shouts “Sign the peition against the GST increase” that caught my attention . Why bother to make sarcastic comments on this forum…Says a lot about you…
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D Mc S
‘It would also be interesting to know what he did in Australia (where he chose to spend most of his working life)’
Well, it rather looks like you’ve answered your own question (i.e. ‘working’) but I expect that, additionally, he broadened his mind before returning to 9 miles by 5 Jersey.
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D Mc S at 63 – He went to Australia in the early 70′s with plans to establish a one-armed bandit machine gambling empire. Ironic, when you listen to his diatribes on the morality of the finance industry…
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People keep going on about massive boards with GET OZOUF OUT, so how could people not know what it was about. A lady came into my shop and asked me to sign the petition. I asked what is was for and she told me is was against the rise in GST. So no mention of getting anyone out.
It wasn’t only on the main street where people we being ‘asked’ to sign the petition.
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60..Opinion management is right……yet it is no secret that Ted and Ozouf clashed mentally and physically in the house…however that is not the issue…if a few misunderstood the purpose of the petition they have been invited to have it withdrawn…either way thousands of people understood the nature of the protest ,signed and apparently would sign again….so a few establishment clones tryng lamely to de rail the protest is predictable,pitiful and Oh so transparent…the wporking people are on their knees here,basics like food and now gas which has been allowed to shoot up 22% in a few months now add 5% to that the profiteering here is crippling and disgusting.we are a sitting duck target,captive audience being totally abused.come on you politicians, do something about it..or maybe we could have a bonfire in the square from the states benches to offer a little warmth.
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Quite right Zoro the establishment know they are on the back foot over many issues now. Something like this petition, if it can be made to stick, will show them in a bad light.
How anyone can ignore Ozouf’s manifesto pledge is beyond me but as they say there’s none so blind, or maybe his supporters don’t want to admit that some also didn’t know what they are signing when they put their crosses on their paper? Come on RT explain that away.
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Let’s face it this one is a no brainer. On the one hand we have Senator Ozouf say that unfortunately the global recession has hit Jersey, the expected taxation revenue is down and in order to protect our public services, pensions and benefits taxation has had to increase. A very unpopular policy which takes a very brave politician to propose.
Then we have the JDA and associated time for change who say that only other people should pay tax and that if they were in power they would increase services and salaries for everybody. Of course we all signed the petition. It’s just come the election we will find out just how gullible the public really are.
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Adrian, I’m not sure the Establishment is on the back foot – if anything it is pushing ahead with bold decisions that are very much necessary. I think many would encourage them to follow up their decisions with more actions, particularly in cutting States’ expenditure.
I would ask what are they faced with? Opponents are poorly organised, argue amongst themselves at a drop of a hat, lack integrity and seem to be driven by jealousy and misguided principle rather than being able to fully assess the challenges we face and come up with pragmatic, fair and electable alternatives.
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I think it is going to take a few years for the States’ policies to work through.
We are only on the easy part of the cuts taper, there are a lot more cuts in the pipeline, including almost certainly the States’ contribution towards the upkeep of the fee paying schools.
What may sink Phillip Ozouf in 2014 might be something completely out of his control. Cameron et al are putting through 20% cuts over the life of this parliament and that could have a big impact on Jersey which is tied to the UK economy more than a lot of people think.
Add in global stagnation and rising commodity prices and the outlook in 2014 could be bleak indeed.
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@ Noah 44
Surely if you are concerned about the youth and their involvement in matters that will concern them in the future you would hope that they receive information in an unbiased manner, rather than being hoodwinked into something that they (likely) lack the grasp of economics for.
This would of course be my argument if the petition had actually been concerning GST rather than petty personal attacks. Asking someone to sign a petition to sack someone else smacks of ‘lowest common denominator’ to me.
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Pip, I agree, we need to be much more bold, thin end of the wedge indeed. You picked an example of cutting subs to fee paying schools, how about cutting the States contribution to hugely generous pensions of its own employees? The biggest elephant in the (chat) room?
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I was asked by the JDA representative to sign a petition against the rise in GST. Not only did he not mention it was actually a petition for the removal or Sen. Ozouf, but when I declined to sign it I was heckled down the street with the words “you must me a millionaire then”
If that is the quality of the political output of the JDA then there can’t be any surprise that they receive little or no support from the Islands voters.
I see no cogent argument by the JDA on how they are going to deal with the effects of the current economic environment. Every economy in the developed world is reducing spending and increasing tax. The fact that we are getting away with relatively modest effects of both should be applauded.
I would agree with an earlier posting when 90,000 have the opportunity to go to the polls and we see what the consensus really is.
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If they read the JEP they probably knew what they were signing. What’s even more astonishing is that the JDA managed to get the second 5000 signatures in just one month.
‘Ozouf must go’ call
THERE were calls for the Treasury Minister to be sacked last night amid claims that he lied to Islanders about raising the rate of GST.
Senator Philip Ozouf came under heavy fire from all sides at last night’s protest rally at Fort Regent, organised by the union Unite, and a petition is now circulating to get him removed from office.
The minister, who recently went back on a promise to the States not to bring a proposal to increase GST, was branded ‘Pinocchio’ and posters bearing his face on the body of the cartoon character, complete with long nose, were placed around the hall.
Around 180 people turned out for the rally – far fewer than were expected and well short of the 1,000 who attended the last protest against GST. However, the crowd remained defiant and many expressed their anger and frustration at the proposed cuts and the current state of Jersey’s political system.
• Read full reports on the rally in today’s JEP
Article posted on 25th November, 2010 – 3.00pm
http://www.thisisjersey.com/2010/11/25/ozouf-must-go-call/#ixzz1CeOc1Mh7
And:
5,000 sign GST protest petition
MORE than 5,000 Islanders have signed a petition calling for the Treasury Minister to be sacked over next year’s GST rise.
The Jersey Democratic Alliance has organised the protest, which is in response to a recent States decision to increase GST from three to five per cent in May next year.
Senator Philip Ozouf has been criticised by the party for breaking an election promise to oppose such an increase and also for the round of cuts he brought to the House this year.
The States effectively ignored a similar petition in 2007, protesting the introduction of GST, which was signed by 19,209 Islanders.
• Read the full report in today’s JEP
Article posted on 31st December, 2010 – 2.58pm
http://www.thisisjersey.com/2010/12/31/5000-sign-gst-protest-petition/#ixzz1CeNRdFRd
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It’s at the ballot box where you can get a States member out. Do the JDA really think their petition will make a difference. Geoff Southern is my deputy unfortunately. My district seem to like the JDA as at one time all 3 of our deputies were JDA members but two have now seen the light! We need decent people in the States not those just blowing hot air!
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