Pedestrians and drivers at cross purposes
Friday 18th February 2011, 2:57PM GMT.
The pedestrian crossing at the end of Commercial Street which joins Conway Street
PARISH and States officials are standing by their decision to place a zebra crossing right at the end of a busy town road.
The positioning of the zebra crossing means that as traffic is waiting to pull out of Commercial Street into Conway Street it is forced to wait on the crossing itself – which is normally in breach of the Highway Code.
The new crossing has been causing confusion for drivers, with a number of them having contacted the JEP to try to get an explanation.
Transport and Technical Services’ acting director of transport, Tristen Dodd, said: ‘Commercial Street is a parish road, so they had to ask our permission to install the crossing. It’s there on a six-month trial basis and the parish are monitoring it to decide whether it will stay there.’
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How daft is this! Just goes to show what numpties work for the Goverment!! Cars cannot exit without breaking the highway code and impedeing pedestrians at the same. Sort of defeats why it was put there in the first place. No doubt we will get cyclists (who are exempt from all road traffic regulations!!) using the Zebra crossing as they do others just adding to the confusion for pedestruian and motorist alike!!!!
As I said numpties!!!!
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Left hand & right hand!
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What a dozy place to put it, move it back 20 feet so the cars don’t have to sit on it to get out of the junction. This is going to cause a lot of confusion, anger and possibly accidents.
Numpties at Transport & Tech.
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Looks like another TTS nonsense to me. Anything that induces confusion on the road is a bad idea.
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who’s mad cap idea was this.
most treat it as a filter in turn as such, .
you know, i go ,you go.
well i let people out at this junction. and if exiting commercial street let people cross the road.
this must come in second place( of daftness) after thre pile of traffic lights at the end of the tunnel.
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Well there’s an accident waiting to happen, isn’t it?
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It is a daft place to put a zebra crossing and I thought so the first time I saw it.
Most drivers let people cross the road there anyway or pedestrians crossed behind a car waiting to exit, exactly as they have to do now!
Waste of time and money.
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Why not create a think tank to come up with some bad ideas and elect a committee to vote for the silliest idea. Why not build a land bridge over the crossing problem solved! OR ban cars from roads.
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TTS must be kept well away from solving this one or we may end up with an underpass or pedestrian footbridge or another Bel Royal style cock-up.
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So technically a policeman could stand there and book every driver who stops on the zebra to pull out!
Sounds like this could provide regular income for the States.
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Matches the one outside the Town Hall then, exit from Seale Street. You know, within 50 yards of the other three!
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As an elected member of the Saint Helier Roads Committee, perhaps I can clarify some points? It’s not a TTS idea – it’s a Parish idea. We proposed, in our meetings which are open to public and media, two crossings as part of the improvements in Commercial Street – one at each end. The Parish does not have the power to implement crossings without the Minister’s approval (although I think it should). The Minister refused permission for the crossing at the Western end but allowed the Parish to go ahead with the one at the Eastern end.
This is not a zebra crossing – it’s a Jersey crossing. So it’s one of our lovely Jersey compromises that fails to be properly reflected by the inappropriate wholesale importation of a foreign Highway Code (and I may add that when the Minister for TTS approved the replacement of the Jersey Highway Code with the UK one, he did not take on board the Saint Helier Roads Committee’s points with regard to desirable clarifications).
@small money: I agree. A filter in turn would probably be supported by the Roads Committee, who are overwhelmingly in favour of filtering in turn. However, our support for filters has been thwarted by longstanding opposition from TTS (although the current Minister is more relaxed than his predecessors).
@Buster Legg: Indeed it is the same system as reinforces pedestrian priority outside the Town Hall. Both junctions are pedestrian priority and it seems to the Roads Committee that a Jersey crossing is the quick, cheap and simple way to signal that situation to road users, regardless of how things might be done differently in the UK.
Your elected Roads Committee members are happy to discuss matters within their remit with constituents and others – and we’re always happy to hear about cheaper and simpler ways to enforce the law. Anything cheaper and simpler than a Jersey crossing?
And why not come along to a Roads Committee meeting to observe how things are discussed and decided? If you’re a Saint Helier voter, don’t forget to lobby your elected members on issues that concern you, and don’t forget to vote in the Roads Committee elections at the end of this year (or stand yourself!)
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This street really doesn’t warrant having a zebra crossing. If the parish insists on it, it should be a few meters away from the yellow line. The current location is ridiculous. I’d like to know the reasons why the parish thinks it is necessary – whatever the reason, the current crossing only makes things worse.
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Which clot thought this up ..? come on let’s name ‘em and shame ‘em…the poor old taxpayer has to cough up for the ineptitude of public sector wally’s again..it is not nearly good enough we want our money back or a rebate.
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Tristen Dodd will you pay the costs and legal fees when there is a prang there or someone is tun down…how idiotic can you be and how much are we paying you to be so pathetically stupid,
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Waste of my flaming TAX payout ONCE AGAIN!!
FAIL FAIL FAIL!!! hahahaha only in Jersey, its like Faulty Towers over here!!
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P.S: Well done to the photographer!!
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thankyou mr jennings(12), for the clarification.
we have both the “jersy way and the jersey crossing”.
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So its the St Helier Roads committee who are the numpties, thanks for the update Mr Jennings. Perpaps you might like to explain the logic behind your thinking….this should be good for a laugh!!!!
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#12 Please, in plain English, what is the exact difference between a Zebra crossing and a Jersey crossing?
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It looks like I wasnt the only one to think that this junction is a mad idea!! In order to respect the zebra crossing you cant be sitting on it, but if you do this you can’t see if there is any traffic coming! It’s an accident waiting to happen!!
From reading above apparently it is a ‘jersey crossing’ but how are we supposed to tell them apart?
Was it really worth the time, money or effort?? The traffic naturally stops at the junction anyway so pedestrians cross behind the car at the line. Simples! I agree with the ‘numpties’ comment…
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20 – #12 Please, in plain English, what is the exact difference between a Zebra crossing and a Jersey crossing?
You have to have lived in Jersey for 10 years continously to be permitted to use it, or else be born locally.
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Perhaps Mr Jennings can now go on to give us his excuse as to why the “Jersey” filter in turn has not been used at any of these junctions?
He has however got a point when he states until anybody of any stature comes forward to do the job properly public money will continue to be wasted on dangerous road design and signage which is in contravention of the Highway Code?
Jersey needs to wake up to the full cost in respect of higher taxes and public waste verses the limited savings through the employment of such an amateur government.
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Before we had all these unnecessary crossings, car drivers used to allow pedestrians to cross. Now this does not happen anywhere near as much, much to the detriment of the dubious pleasure of being a pedestrian in town.
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A Jersey crossing is a marked advisory crossing consisting of stripes (no Belisha beacons). Like the filter in turn system it relies on common sense and courtesy. You’ll notice several Jersey crossings around Town which work well, and have worked well for years. Just because they do not have them in the UK is no reason to reject them.
The Saint Helier Roads Committee (which is the highways authority for Parish-administered roads) has been forcefully pursuing successive States committees and ministers (the highways authority for main roads) for filters in turn. We’re getting somewhere, but slowly – since we don’t have the powers to introduce these systems.
The junction in question is a pedestrian priority junction under the highway code (both old version and new version) so the Jersey crossing reinforces (very cheaply) pedestrian priority – it doesn’t create it. If one were to put a Jersey crossing further back (incidentally in a place not on a desire line and where there is no demand) one would be creating an extra courtesy crossing and the pedestrian priority crossing across the end of Commercial Street would still exist. I don’t think there’s any justification for two crossings in such a short distance. But the crossing at the Western end of Commercial Street would be useful.
Why Jersey crossings? Unfortunately, there are some vehicle operators who fail to yield to pedestrians at priority crossings. A cheap and simple paint job seems to work much better at raising awareness than other alternatives such as junction tables – and it’s certainly cheaper and more people-friendly to rely on what it fashionably called a “nudge”, than to start sending out officers to book motorists who fail to yield to pedestrians.
And the Jersey crossing reinforcing the walking route along Conway Street certainly seems to have raised awareness, as I gather from some of the comments that there were people who apparently did not realise that yielding to pedestrians was obligatory at this junction.
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This is not a zebra crossing – it’s a Jersey crossing. So it’s one of our lovely Jersey compromises that fails to be properly reflected by the inappropriate wholesale importation of a foreign Highway Code (and I may add that when the Minister for TTS approved the replacement of the Jersey Highway Code with the UK one, he did not take on board the Saint Helier Roads Committee’s points with regard to desirable clarifications). Quote..Unquote, More like a Jersey cockup it seems.
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“I gather from some of the comments that there were people who apparently did not realise that yielding to pedestrians was obligatory at this junction” – I thought it was obligatory on every road.
Mr. Jennings your limited of knowledge of the highway code combined with your lack of any common sense make you a danger is such an important position. Please stop wasting our money and hand over to somebody with an ounce of intelligence. With a credible person doing the job maybe we will get our “filter in turns” back.
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Geraint Jennings says the crossings work well. That’s because, before all the waste of paint, drivers used to allow pedestrians to cross anywhere they wanted. However it’s kept a few parish painters in work.
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what a joke .it was better when you could drive the other way along commercial street .st helier you realy make me giggle .ha ha
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