Health stubs out smoking at all departmental premises
Saturday 18th February 2012, 2:50PM GMT.
Smoking is to be banned throughout all Health Department buildings
SMOKING is to be banned in the grounds of every Health department building in a drive to improve conditions for patients and staff.
Currently, smokers are allowed to light up in designated areas outside many of the Health department’s sites, including the large garden at the General Hospital.
But from 14 March, staff and patients at all buildings – including the Hospital – will be forced onto the streets if they want to smoke.
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Another step in the right direction. The next stage should be to ban it in the streets as well so that it is safe for us to walk about in town and be able to breath relatively uncontaminated air.
Hopefully the day will come when there is a total ban on the sale and use of all tobacco products in Jersey as I have been to too many funerals for those who were addicted to it.
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Smoking tabaco is not illegal so banning it island wide will it’s self infringe the law so it will never happen. Another thought….everyone stops smoking tomorrow your taxes would increase by the following month to cover the duty, taxes and gst lost to the island. Do you drive.? If so you pollute my air when walking in town, not going to ban driving any time soon are they.?
Those that choose to smoke do so at their own risk and the risks are plain to see.
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I think bringing transport into the debate to justify smoking is a little tenous! If you are so concerned about pollution from transport I take it you either walk or cycle everywhere on the Island, sail or swim to get off it, grow your own veggies, raise your owns animals in your garden for meat and to make clothing, live in a house made of sustainable wood transported by horse etc, etc! I choose not to smoke as does my two year old girl and I thoroughly object to having to walk through clouds of fag smoke in town due to the smokers outside satisfying their deadly habit. I also think that if it did come to pass that smoking was made illegal the money saved from treating smokers for their many smoking related ailments would probably equal the tax revenue lost in sales!
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Replying to Gaf and Tobias #7 if you care to look at the UK statistics it was proven beyond doubt that an outright ban on smoking and the loss in revenue to HM Custons would not result in a positive cash benefit with regards to money saved from health and that involved in treating patients with smoking related diseases. I suspect the same would apply here in the Island.
Furthermore if we were to ban the sale and the smoking of tobacco products it would have to extend to the Airport and ferries coming to and from Jersey, or would you feel it appropriate to sell the insidious cancer sticks to those departing our shores, a little disingenuous if you do.
Assuming then your wish for the total ban is implemented then start saving hard for the next air or sea trip because the revenue gained from the sale of “duty free’s ” is in part applied to fares and landing charges.
I am a non smoker, never have been and have no wish to start now but I think we have gone far enough in the casting as social pariahs those that choose to smoke and pay high taxation for their legal pursuit.
I very much doubt that walking past an office worker huddled in a doorway on a wet and cold morning who is having their nicotine fix is hardly going to be life threatening for the healthy passer by.
Live and let live.
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I have not justified smoking, i point out in my comment that people have a choice if to smoke or not and why should i not bring cars into it? As you state ” I thoroughly object to having to walk through clouds of fag smoke in town” so why don’t you walk around it or not walk though town at all? is it because you have to? no choice? Same here, i have to walk though town but i can’t stop the traffic so every one who drives is polluting my airspace but i don’t see the States banning traffic in town.
“that smoking was made illegal” so where does it stop… close all pubs and make alcohol is illegal?
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Yes smokers choose to smoke at their own risk, but it is more damaging for people who have to breathe passive smoke, which they are not choosing!
Why should non smokers have to put up with cigarette smoke in common areas. The health risks are well known, in fact it is more hamful for passive smokers than for the actual smoker as they are breathing more of the sidestream smoke than the smoker. The sidestream smoke (coming from the tip of the burning end) has about double the tar and nicotine than the air being directly inhaled by the smoker.
As most people know, smoke contains around 4000 chemical compounds at least 40 of which are known carcinogens, it also contains carbon monoxide which inhibits the transport of oxygen to vital organs. It does this by binding with red blod cells to form carboxyhemoglobin. It takes 5 hours for the concentration of these carboxyhemoglobin cells to reduce by half, in the meantime your oxygen carrying capacity is limited.
Reduced tissue oxygen saturation has been assosiated with poor postoperative outcomes therefore banning smoking in all hospital grounds is the right thing to do. The official stance on smoking is that it is detrimental to health, so allowing it on their grounds is a bit hypocritical
As for rights, how about the rights of the non smokers!!!
It doesn’t help the smoking issue when so many smokers are inconsiderate with their rubbish i.e. cigarette ends and empty packets left lying around sometimes not even put out first.
Get off your high horses and stop with the cries of infringment of civil liberties and accept that smoking is no longer socially acceptable and smoking in public areas is on the way out.
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Two stories about public health.
One is inadequate cover which could have resulted in the death of a patient.The other a ban on smoking in hospital grounds,which will have to be policed,resulting on resources being spread even thinner.This is just a ludicrous power trip by the great and the good,which will result in the public seeing patients out on the street smoking in their pyjamas.
Bl**dy ludicrous!
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Lewton
What are you on…..there is no “fag” police to keep control of the already unlawful smoking in public buildings.
It is clearly frowned upon by the majority and any persons caught can be prosecuted….but the police have better things to do.
Murder is also illegal….we could all be potential murderers….but we don’t all have a copper assigned to each and every one of us in case we commit this crime now do we???
If we see patients out in the streets having a fag in their pyjamas then personally I would hope they are paying for their healthcare themselves….I would be disgusted if we are paying for them to get better and yet at the same time they are slowly killing themselves with cigarettes!!!
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Same old, same old, there cannot be anyone alive at the moment who is not thoroughly aware of the dangers of excessive smoking and drinking, and they keep on and on, while ignoring issues more important to the survival of Jersey, e.g. immigration, unemployment and political reform, why do they not just BAN smoking everywhere and anywhere in Jersey, unless money perhaps may have something to do with it.
Talking of money, I have repeatedly tried to ascertain just how many millions were spent on the “Swine Flu” vaccination, that is to say, those of us who survived the “Bird Flu”,
My requests were met with the usual “data protection” stuff.
Any time that there is an imminent crisis in Jersey, there is always a perfectly timed diversion such as the “Bridge to France” or even “European Central Time”
At the moment it is once again smoking, which appears to be more important than the uncontrolled immigration in the Island.
It is a shame that none of our politicians have the guts to tell the truth, I suppose it is easier just to “nod” your head, and pick up your £45,000.
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Absolutely pathetic.
How does this ban in outdoor areas ‘improve conditions for patients and staff’? I think traffic fumes in town are slightly more of a problem!
Presumably some highly paid administrator has thought up this idea which will cost thousands to implement and control.
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Sporran
DO tell how it will “cost thousands to implement and control”.
To any clear thinking and sane person, this is the right thing to do. Health departments’ exist to help make people BETTER, whilst smoking (which is killing the smoker and anybody nearby breathing in their passive smoke) makes people WORSE!
Do you see the problem now?
Imagine if criminals were allowed to deal drugs in the police station car park…….
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Well for starters, they are bringing in an expert from the UK to advise them.
Smoking in open areas such as the garden causes minimal harm to non-smokers.
If you read the last report to the States on air quality, the main factors were traffic, bellozane(which was sill operating at the time) and even the heating system at the general hospital was considerd to have an impact on outside air quality. Passive smoking was not even mentioned.
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This will not reduce smoking or protect the general public from the effects of smoking, all it will do is create a mass of fag butts out on the street outside all Health Department buildings. Lovely!!
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That large Garden out in open air,I spent the last hour with my best friend so he could have a smoke just hours before he died.So to all you do gooders that dont smoke,If you happen to have a friend who is about to die and wants a last smoke I excpect to see you sitting on the street lets hope its not raining,Totally Disgusting way to be treated
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“Absolutely pathetic”.
“I think traffic fumes in town are slightly more of a problem!”
“All you do-gooders that don’t smoke…”
“Just a ludicrous power trip”.
See, that’s the problem with smokers. They are so used to the smell of cigarettes that they don’t realise how gross it is to everyone else, and so they think we’re just making a fuss about nothing. They think it’s up to them if they smoke, and conveniently forget that they poison others around them, not to mention make a mess of the pavements with their carelessly-strewn butts.
I’d much rather inhale traffic fumes – they may be harmful but nowhere near as bad as tobacco. At least they’re not carcinogenic! Nor do cars leave butts everywhere as they go along the roads.
I’m pretty sure there would be a law against someone walking through town carrying an open bag of manure. Yet you’re allowed to walk around with a foul-smelling cancer stick?
Similarly, it would certainly be highly illegal to carry around an open box of harmful carcinogenic chemicals in public. Yet it’s not illegal to carry around the same chemicals if it’s packed into a paper tube and called a cigarette?
Finally, why do they get away with throwing their butts on the floor? Blatant littering. Do they honestly think the fag-fairies come out at night and pick them all up?
Disgusting, highly antisocial habit. I for one can’t wait until it’s banned outright.
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Interesting rant!
I am and always have been a non-smoker.
Do you seriously think that someone smoking in outdoor gardens has an impact on air quality? Traffic fumes are probably 1,000 times worse!
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“Get off your high horses and stop with the cries of infringment of civil liberties and accept that smoking is no longer socially acceptable and smoking in public areas is on the way out.”
Lets ban drinking then? just as bad as smoking, causes loads of deaths, fills the hospital and hostels, louts around town on evenings the list goes on.
I am not arguing that smoking should not be banned in working premises or confined spaces but in public open air spaces or in private a smoker has every right to smoke.
Lets think about banning drinking and pubs and see how many people come forward and claim its their right to drink.
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In private it may not be good either. If a smoker has children or a spouse or any pets these will be exposed to their smoking habits even if the smoker goes out and has a fag away from the house everytime they get the urge. This is unlikely to happen when it is near zero and pouring with rain. Even then if they do smoke outside the stink still lingers on their clothing.
Drinking to excess is bad as well. However there is a major difference between smoking and drinking. Drinking in moderation can be good for health. Smoking in moderation is still bad for your health as well as others exposed to your emmissions.
No one has a right to endanger another person’s health.
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If the smoker has other people in their premises then yes i agree this is a danger to the non smokers like children etc. The person smoking should be mindful of this fact and go outside or even consider quitting.
“Drinking in moderation is good for you” – wheres the proof of this?
“No one has a right to endanger another person’s health.” – so having couple of drinks in moderation and then driving a car is not endangering mine or anyone elses life?
“No one has a right to endanger another person’s health.” – Walk though town on a weekend though all the drunks and tell me if you feel safe?
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Mark even if a smoker goes outside the stink is still all over their clothes when they come back in.
Some medical research has indicated that certain alcoholic drinks are beneficial to health in moderation.
Mark which has caused more deaths?
Smoking or alchol?
Even low consumption of secondary smoking is known to kill other people. Low consumption of alcohol is much less likely to kill anyone else.
Unfortunately as stress levels increase caused in the main by work so alcohol and drug abuse will continue to soar.
I agree there is alcohol abuse, as with drugs in Jersey, and it is reaching epidemic proportions.
However smoking is the only legal thing I can think of which when used as intended actually kills large numbers of innocent bystanders.
I agree anti-social behaviour of any type is not nice for those on the receiving end.
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Mark G
Don’t be ridiculous.
If a person is drinking alcohol, the alcohol they are drinking does not cause harm to anybody else but themselves.
For the louts etc….well, that is where the police get involved (as they should for smokers too) and make arrests when other people are at risk from their actions.
Excessive eating also kills….do we ban food?
If people want to smoke in private then fair enough….but ONLY if they are causing no harm to anybody who doesn’t want to breathe in the smoke….that includes those who cannot speak for themselves such as children or animals!
Here’s a novelty…..in the same way a pub exists for drinkers to congregate and socialise…..why not introduce “smoking houses” purely for those who want to slowly kill themselves?
That way we could save ourselves the earache from every smoker who feels persecuted….(yet fails to acknowledge their own ignorance on the subject!)
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Comical! Do you seriously think that “traffic fumes are probably 1000 times worse?”
I suggest you do some research on the subject before spouting such nonsense.
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Traffic fumes are a complex mix of bi-products formed by the combustion process of the engine. They contain hundreds of pollutants, the most damaging of which include:
Benzene
Formaldehyde
Lead
Carbon monoxide
Sulphur dioxide
Polycyclic hydrocarbons (PAHs)
Tiny suspended particles (particulates)
The combined effect of these pollutants on the human body is extremely detrimental and includes lung and heart problems, damage to DNA, and the risk of cancer.
Traffic fumes also boost the production of oxygen free radicals which cause tissue damage and contribute to the production of harmful, ground-level ozone which damages the bronchial passages and lungs – and which is rising at a rate of six percent every ten years.
Might be worth taking a bit of your own advice
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Smoking has come down very significantly in the last 30 years, however there are still a significant number of people who do indulge. If you ban the sale of cigarettes, you will find people seeking to get round the law and smoking various forms of illegal cigarettes that will damage their health at a faster rate. The concern that I have (and I am a non smoker) is that I’m really not sure where all this is leading to – lets have a think on this one. Further bans on alcohol, fatty foods so on and so forth. So we get ‘healthier’ and that means we live longer – in a world that is already over populated (let alone an island too crowded). So living longer, what does that entail, oh yes getting less and less able to do things, memory loss, all leading to needing more and more care. So in the long term are we actually going to save any money if we end up with more and more people in the 80′s and older that will need caring, support, medicines etc. I think any further bans have to be very carefully thought through. As regards to the Hospital – I believe that provision should be made for a limited amount of smokers (ie the patients) Everyone else has a choice as to where they go and should do so away from the Hospital buildings and grounds. Like Bean I say Live and let live too.
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Its all about rights now, in my opinion
Do we have the right to ban people from doing something they want even if is bad for them, we try to discourage them, tax/health warnings ect.
Is it only tax which stops goverments from banning these things?
Obviously they ban other substances, what stops them from banning smoking, alcohol ect?
Otherside, do they have the right to do something that might have ill effect on people passing by?
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the air quality of town is not that good.
and if you want a fag, the E cigarette is ok. you can even use them on the ward if you tell them you have one .
when is a smoker not a smoker?
when they are a vapper.
i am going to become a vapper soon when the duty free has run out.
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Lewton; interesting statistics. But still, the point was, it’s comical to claim that vehicle emissions are 1000 times worse than tobacco smoke. See the excellent post by Tiana above for stats on the latter.
JPS asked:”Do we have the right to ban people from doing something they want even if is bad for them”
I would say No, we do not, and should not attempt to do so. I wholeheartedly disagree with the nanny-state mentality. Indeed I am of the opinion that cannabis should be decriminalised – the war on drugs is a lost battle which costs society dearly, and the harm caused to the user by the substance itself is far outweighed by the damage done to his career should he get charged with possession. If people know the risks and choose to do so anyway, up to them – if it harms none, do as you will.
Tobacco smoke, however, can and does harm others, in particular children in the household (I speak from experience here having grown up in a smoke-filled house).
For that reason I would love to see smoking banned outright. At the very least, it should be banned in all public places – it seems that we are moving towards that goal, albeit slowly.
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Utter drivel.
We are talking about banning smoking OUTDOORS here, not about ‘harming children in the houshold’
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Sporran
Utter drivel!!
We are talking about banning smoking OUTDOORS ….. within a HEALTH facility ….actually!!
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By banning smoking you are criminalising it,which will lead to a similar farce to the one that you have with cannabis.I would imagine that education and not draconian rules and regulations are the way forwards.
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Lewton
Smoking has not been banned……only smoking in PUBLIC areas. You can still smoke yourself to death on your own, somewhere private!
I didn’t realise we could buy cannabis in a shop or supermarket over here……
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I think if people choose to smoke in their own homes it’s fine providing no non smoker is exposed to the effects. Same with alcohol and other drugs, providing no one else is affected I don’t see the problem.
One area that is not policed is smoking in the workplace, how many white van drivers do you see smoking in the company vehicle, effectively an extension of the workplace. Pull them over and fine them and the company, also those who discard their fag ends in the street fine them, that should generate some much needed cash as well as make the streets cleaner.
Jerseybean your friend did he die of a smoking related illness, half of all smokers do and of those that remain half suffer s smoking related health problem, that leaves one in four smokers unnafected. Personally I’d take crack cocaine – it’s safer.
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Question: You find out having quit smoking 4 years previously that you have lung cancer. In fear of the possible slow and unplesant end (which was not a certainty) you sit in your garage with all openings closed and let the car run. Was it the cancer or the car fumes that killed my friend? I cycled into town today and the stench of fumes was very noticable even with a breaze. Not a smoker in sight. Face the real facts, whilst there is money to be made, neither smoking nor cars will be banded.
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It was so cool in the 60 s and advertised everywhere. It took a few decades to realize it was bad. So blame the government for allowing the sale of fags.
It like buying fags in the airport but having nowhere to smoke them : Thank you for your custom and stuff you !
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The States should build a air tight chamber where all smokers can go and smoke themselves to death,the world is overpopulated anyway.
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Yeah, overpopulated with people like you.
What right do you have to judge?
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I have no right to judge but i do have the right to breath clean air and not be poisened by filthy fag smoke.Most people who smoke are selfish they light up around people who dont smoke.
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A little more reason in your second comment, where exactly have you been inflicted with second hand smoke, your comment makes it sound like you’re wafting through plumes of second hand smoke every second?
Is it selfishness that causes smokers to smoke or is it that they don’t even consider random people. It is not an active consideration to cause you harm. Unlike your wishes.
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tricky one this. Blame the smokers for everything! I don,t smoke and i don,t drive either but i have to breathe your filthy car exhaust fumes in the street, so passing a smoker in the street is no bother. And of course folks we are all breathing rancid air leaking out of those nuke power stations on the french coast to boot. acid rain is falling daily, cows farts are more damaging than the man smoking outside the office and pub.
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Patients having to sign discharge papers each time they want to light up…..Administrative farce will ensue……we have the monopoly on screwing up here don’t we really …if there is a nest of Bulls**T to get in we dive in head first every time….how much do we pay these genius minds to come up with such Keystone cops ideas.
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I really cannot believe people are arguing over this ….. it is a no brainer!!
Health facilities are places where people go to get BETTER…..smoking kills, not just the smoker but also those around them….this makes people WORSE.
It is simply STUPID to continue allowing something which makes your health WORSE in a facility where the sole intention is to make your health BETTER!!
I suppose you same people would think it a good idea to allow child visits for a convicted Paedo!!
Is that any clearer for some of you??
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False analogy.
So much rhetoric, you could be a politician.
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Why is that JPSpecial?
Think about it a bit more and it might make more sense.
You call it rhetoric…..I call it common sense
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Well, you don’t treat your patient outside do you ?!
Smoking kills but my doctor smokes like a cheminee !!!???
Booze is bad for you, you go to the pub.
Mc Donald is crap, but you still eat it.
Sky diving is dangerous, why doing it?
Drugs are bad, why people take them ?
Cars are not allowed to go fast than 130Km/h, why do they go at 220Km/h.
Planes pollute, why use them ?
Can buy fags, why not smoking them ?
I am still confused … sorry…
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Kermit
That is not the point – it is hypocrisy!
You don’t try to help people get healthier inside and then allow them to get unhealthy outside…..within the same facility!
I choose to go to the pub….but I am not dragging along a random person.
I choose to drink, but it is not going down the throat of a random person.
You may choose to smoke, but the person breathing in your fumes may not!
Nobody is saying you cannot smoke in your own private place…..but you should not be allowed to force your habot on others in public areas (inside or out).
You choose to kill yourself slowly then that is YOUR choice…..you killing someone else slowly….is tantamount to manslaughter!
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