Why does having children give you special privileges?
Friday 25th November 2011, 3:00PM GMT.
From Monica Conlan.
IN response to the letter and article entitled ‘People parking in the Parent and child places’ I quite agree that parents need extra wide spaces to open their car doors to enable them to deal with a child seat etc. Heaven knows, I get infuriated when I return to my parked car, to find another dent or scratch made by careless, inconsiderate drivers or their passengers.
But, why, oh, why, must these spaces be next to the disabled spaces right outside the shop door? Can’t they walk? I have witnessed young mums parking in disabled spaces, and when I have plucked up enough courage to ask why, I have been met with a mouthful of abuse, and one young mum even went on to tell me that she parked in a disabled space because she was pregnant.
I have seen elderly people struggle with their shopping to the back of the car parks. Surely, as these mums are usually the younger and fitter variety, it should be them parking at the back of the car parks.
Why is it that just because they have children they expect to be given special privileges, and want special parking permits, and other drivers to be fined if they park in ‘their spaces’, while the rest of us just get on with it, and walk through car parks.
What these parents need to remember is, a lot of the roads and car parks in Jersey are a lot narrower than the norm, and everybody that uses them needs to be considerate of other users, and stop this ‘me-me-me-greed’ that is sweeping the Island.
Perhaps, if they got a smaller vehicle instead of these huge ‘containers on wheels’ they would be able to park in any space, or even better, as we live on a beautiful Island, with beautiful weather, get out and walk to the shops.
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Considering that abusive language is not an offense UK judge decides we must expect to hear even more of this abuse in society now OMG.
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This is a typical response to anything that is written in relation to parents getting any kind of special privilages. As a parent of two young children , I know the dangers of being in a carpark and trying to get through it safely with your kids , people reversing without looking , driving to fast etc, I think this is the main reason for the spaces being so close to the door. Anyone who feels the need to complain about a childs safety coming first really has to much time on their hands. Also I think that you buy into the sterotypical mum that again is really only mentioned by people like yourself , I do not know many mums who drive around in “huge containers on wheels”. Really is it that big an issue that a few spaces are reserved ,I have scene several older people using the parent and child places and never felt the need to confront them but again if it was the other way around I am sure they would have something to say to me.
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The reason why parent spaces are located ‘so close’ to the entrances of shops is simple, car seats and children are HEAVY, and children sometimes erratic in behaviour!
It isn’t because parents are lazy, it is because children are not robots, they do not necessarily do what they are told all of the time, and crossing a car park is not the safest of options. I would like to see Monica shepherd 2,3 or sometimes 4 children through a busy supermarket carpark……
It has NOTHING to do with me-me-me-greed, it has to do with common sense and common decency.
What does the narrowness of the islands roads have to do with anything, does Monica think all parents also drive huge, wide 4X4 vehicles therefore being inconsiderate to other road users?
Personally, I feel there should be more parent child spaces or atleast make some of the spaces multi puropse – parent child or disabled.
Come on Monica, think about it before you put pen to paper!
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Does Monica has any children? Does she knows that some people are food shopping for week and shopping bags are heavy! Try to carry 3 shopping bags and look after a kid who’s running or carry a car seat across the busy car park and than write all this crap! Idiot!!!!!!!!!
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Oh my goodness! I’m not a Mum quite yet but having read this I’m fuming! I am assuming Monica is not a Mum herself from the tone of the letter & therefore absolutely clueless. I don’t understand her issue with the parent & child spaces being next to the disabled spaces ?? Also it doesn’t take a genius to work out that its a lot safer and easier to walk from shop to car with child/children, trolley and other cars around if the spaces are right outside and not have to ‘just get on with it and walk through the carpark’ !! And why shouldn’t parents have bigger cars if they want to, much easier with prams, car seats & all the other bits u need to cart around when u have children.
It makes more sense for her to walk to the shops than parents with their children in tow and how does she expect them to carry all the bags home?? I’m surprised she didn’t suggest Mums get taxis everywhere to free up parking spaces !!
Absolutely ridiculous.
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This is the most selfish and stupid article i have ever laid eyes on. You have been very judgemental and stereotypical of mothers. Not all parents have ‘huge containers on wheels’, infact they are called CARS, which are needed to transport precious children fron A to B. I personally have one child and only have a Ford Fiesta but have you seen a pram?? Clearly you haven’t! Well Monica they take up quite alot of room, so much that it spawls out onto the back seat of my car! Therefore if someone was to have twins or more than one young child then they would need a bigger CAR!
Clearly you havent got a child or havent been in a young baby/toddlers company as you would know that you need to have the trolley/pushchair near by to put them in, out of the busy road! Therefore P&C spaces are a massive safety nessassity then a space issue!!!
I think you should think about your opinons before you voice them and think about how you come accross!
The fact you are calling all parents lazy by trying to stress the fact that YOU walk to your car through the carpark is an invalid point! Have you seen the amount of people that speed? It just takes one person to think they are a racer before an accident occurs!
As you can tell, i feel very strongly about this issue and rude people like yourself!
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Well, she did ask “Why does having children give you special privileges?”
Sit back, Monica, while all the mums tell you!
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There is a reason many parents have 4 x 4′s and
it is to do with practicalities if school bags and
Sports kits etc – a large boot is required !
I agree with you totally about disabled spaces but
the rest of your letter is ridiculous.
Are you suggesting a mother of 3 or a women who
is 8 months pregnant should walk to the shop for her
weekly shopping ?!?!? This is whilst she carries
the school bags too yes ?
Get a life grumpy and think before you write something
so ridiculous
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An absolute ludicrous complaint with no strength whatsoever!
Two questions for Monica Conlan.
1) DO YOU HAVE CHILDREN ?
and if so,
2) DO YOU WANT TO ** KEEP THEM SAFE ** ?
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Clearly another clueless woman with no children. If you had any idea what it was like to carry a child in a car seat, you’d like the spaces to be closer! St Peters Co-Op have the parent and child spaces further away from the shop, with the disabled closer.
It amuses me how you say we should ‘get out and walk to the shops.’ Would you walk carrying a 2 stone bag with you plus shopping bags? Because clearly you’re not a parent and have never tried pushing a pram AND a trolly around a super market, not the easiest of tasks. Do you expect us to leave the pram at home and carry 2,3,4 children to the shop? Completely clueless… And what about those mothers who have had c-sections or difficult labours, should they walk to the shops too??
And I hate this idea that all Mums drive 4×4′s. The only people I know that drive them are people without children, and I know a LOT of parents. It’s such a false stereotype.
Now, I suggest as this is such a beautiful Island, you quit the letter writing about things you know nothing about, and go and enjoy our Island!
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What annoys me is when you have some spaces for “parent and child” and some which are for anyone.
I have seen a mother park in the last “ordinary” space which is available, even where there were parent and child spaces left. This was at a place where parking is extremely difficult.
It was a selfish and thoughtless act and, I can only imagine, was motivated by the fact that the “ordinary” space was about three yards closer to the direction in which she eventually waddled off.
Either that or she was utterly oblivious to the needs of others, a trait which is commonplace now and which explains a lot of the behavioural problems of children, who acquire such behaviour from their ignorant parents.
If “parent and child” spaces are provided, then surely parents and children should be forced to use them? I am sure that someone would have thrown a wobbly had I parked in the parent and child space but it seems that the door only swings one way when it comes to the rest of us having to pay for other people’s children and to tiptoe round them in case mummy or daddy gets cross and starts hurling abuse.
If people want to have children, it is their problem- not everyone elses.
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Shocked that someone has written this. Must me brave thou, with how much stick she’s gonna get now.
First, parents usually have a bigger car as they need it as children come with a lot of bagage when travelling.
Secondly, parents need wider spaces as car seats for smaller sleeping babies is not easy to get out of a car that is tight up against the next, even getting a older child out of the car needs the door to be held open widely. And most parents take great car not to scratch of damage the next car.
Thirdly, how danagerous is it walking through a carpark with small children even more so when there is more than one child. WE ARE NOT LAZY!!!!
Also some pregnant women need and have been recommend bu the GP to use the designated space and they mah have complications in there pregnancy meaning they have difficulty walking.
These space are not a privilage.
Highly annoyed.
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3; you’ve hit the mail on the head there Steve. The problem is indeed caused by childhood obesity. Pandering to people by allowing these spaces simply makes the matter worse. In short:
1. “Parent and child” spaces increase the sense of delusional self-entitlement which parents appear to now foster;
2. It increases “spoilt brat” syndrome;
3. It makes overweight parents and children yet more overweight. The problem becomes self fulfilling because hefty individuals and their clearly equally hefty offspring don’t want to walk. If they are pandered to, they will fail to walk and will thus become heavier. As weight increases, so will the demands for special treatment (and pies).
4. The dedicated spaces increase the perceived difference between ordinary people and those with children to whom, it would seem, the rest of us owe some kind of duty or living.
And so it goes on. And on. And on.
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Monica excellent letter and it’s something that has irked me for some time. If people choose to have children and in so doing accept the benefits, reduced taxation, allowances etc while the child free shoulder the cost then why do they not accept that there is a down side too.
I feel like a pariah when I park my car out of eyeshot of the shop, I think there is a market for taxis to and from parking spaces. I take particular offence at the Co Op which is meant to be a co operative where all members are equal, some more than others it would seem. It’s bad enough that my shopping experience is made the poorer by screaming unsupervised kids tearing around the isles but giving them priority parking as well – how about a child free supermarket, I’d be there like a shot.
As an aside do the 4X4 monstrosities have a reverse gear, I’ve never seen it engaged, inevitably when I encounter one of these behemoths on a country lane the mother and single child occupant freeze inches from a passing place while I reverse 500 metres and am not even thanked for doing so.
I don’t understand why you would own a vehicle that is optimised for a purpose it will never serve, unless the states in their wisdom decide to spend £10 million building a mountain.
Here’s an idea ladeez, leave the little buggers at home , park in a normal space and give the rest of us some peace.
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“I feel like a pariah when I park my car out of eyeshot of the shop, ”
Really? You feel like a pariah because you are not parked at the entrance?
“Here’s an idea ladeez, leave the little buggers at home , park in a normal space and give the rest of us some peace.”
And here is another idea, get a life. No one is having a child, going to the shops or parking in eyeshot(sic) to upset you. Just take a breath and think a happy thought.
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I have two children under five, and yes I do use mother and baby spaces. Not because I am lazy, but because trying to get my sons car seat out of the car without opening the door very wide, is a nightmare. And yes monica would probably consider my car a container on wheels, but with three kids, a hubby and two dogs, it would be very hard to get two kids car seats and the whole family in anything smaller (oh and I would love to drive something smaller as big cars are expensive.) I walk as much as I possibly can, but it’s very hard to get a weeks shopping in the buggy, whilst pushing it and holding onto another small child. I would NEVER use a disabled space, but I do thing mother and baby spaces are important and should be respected.
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As usual the anti child brigade have started
When i was pregnant with my youngest i was told i could apply for a blue badge as i had what is known as SPD which is a pelvic problem making it difficult for me to walk.
Why is it then that if you are moaning about us having the spaces, do you think its ok for people who do not have children to park in parent and child spaces. I watched 4 different people do it at grand marche yesterday.
You say that you are fined for parking in parent spaces however unfortunatly there isn’t a place on the island that will actually fine people who park there when they are not supposed to.
As for using a pushchair and walking should we ask the elderly to do the same so they don’t take up so many parking spaces when you want to park? Not everyone drives a massive car, personally i have a fairly standard 3 door hatchback. So do most parents i know personally.
Please don’t tar all parents with the same brush. And don’t park in our spaces.
And as for the me me me me, surely this letter is far more indulgant of the me me me attitude, with a little foot stamping, arm crossing and ‘its not fair’ added in for good measure?
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If you are eligible for a blue badge then you are disabled to some degree. Plenty of women get up to the day before birth without ever being remotely disabled, once upon a time it wasn’t even uncommon for them to work right up until the birth. It seems that with advances in medicine pregnant women have become less capable, not more capable!
It is always worth remembering that today’s society does not allow for people who may have suffered a short-term injury, or those who have chronic conditions that flare up from time to time but don’t make them eligible for a blue badge. Frankly, if someone is using the parent and child spaces (unlike some on here I don’t believe they are solely for mothers) but has no child in tow, it is always worth considering that they may genuinely have to park as near as possible to the shop and have no other option!
Society as a whole needs to be more tolerant and accept that they should, if they can (and that includes people with children) leave the spaces nearest the shop for those that genuinely need them!
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Parents’ think they should have better conditions due to reasons A, B & C. Non Parents don’t think they should have better conditions due to reasons X, Y & Z.
If a supermarket chooses to give parking spaces to parents then that is their choice. Either you accept it or you shop elsewhere.
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Monica should just see the parking scenario as the best possible indicator that the shop is to be avoided at all costs!
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Q: Why does having children give you special privileges?
A: Because it’s all me, me, me.
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This letter makes sweeping and insulting statements about parents based on a few negative experiences. Thankfully society has evolved enough to provide parent and baby spaces in some places to make life a little easier and far safer. I’ve heard the comment “Take my disabled space, take my disability” but how about “take my parent and toddler space, take my children!!!” Walk a mile in other people’s shoes before you pass comment.
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Fiona, you cannot equate having children to having a disability, that is disgusting, you choose to have children, no-one chooses to have a disability!
It’s also worth noting that in some shops in the mainland the safer spaces for parking with children are actually further away from the shop yet the parent and child parking is nearest to the shop, what is the thinking there? It certainly isn’t the safety of the children.
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Agreed 17, of course it isn’t illegal to use the parent and child spaces on private land, even when you don’t have a child. Those with children can merely go to a more convenient facility if they wish. It’s all them, them, them and they can go, go, go elsewhere!
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I totally agree with the letter. Society has become totally baby obsessed.
Not all parents, but many, have this let the little darlings do as they please, scream and run around unchallenged, and if you dare to tell them off you are a pedo.
Our entire welfare system is built around workers paying for these little darlings
and now after being told for years that there is a problem with the ‘ageing population’ we have 600 plus unemployed and hundreds more at Highlands being trained for non existant jobs.
It is not the elderly that are making people’s lives a misery in the Town Park area every nigh – they are people’s overindulged offspring.
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Well said Overpopulated (as always). No-one seems to want to teach their children about safety anymore. I don’t know a single person who was knocked down as a child while going shopping with their parent/s, and that was before the days of these kinds of supermarket setups (i.e. when you had to cross roads carrying all your bags etc.) People managed absolutely fine.
Now we mollycoddle the children AND the parents, and does anyone actually learn anything from it? Today’s parents seem to be far less capable than those that went before them, I don’t see how that can possibly be a benefit to society!
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Blah blah blah children’s pressure group spokeswoman, turn the record over, blah blah blah.
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* Disabled people- can’t help their affliction, lifestyle not by choice.
* People with children- can help it, lifestyle adopted by choice. Their decision, their responsibility, not everyone else’s problem.
“Why does having children give you special privileges?”
It doesn’t.
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Unfortunately, irony can’t be communicated as well on this kind of forum!
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It sounds like supermarket car parks are dangerous places. Perhaps we should have full health and safety checks, together with an enhanced CRB (criminal record) check on everyone who walks through there or who might be 100 yards in the vicinity. A jackbooted person who takes him or herself very seriously could stand at the entrance with a clipboard and a fingerprinting kit.
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just a reminder to the kids haters…..
if no sympathy or empathy, than look at it this way: these little people will be looking after you when you are old, such as paying tax. etc. BE NICE.
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It’s funny that you assume people hate kids. What you see on here is that people hate bad/selfish parents.
Do people have a right to hate bad parents? Yes! The inability and selfishness of bad parents has a negative effect on the whole of society (on top of the damage it does to the child). Do people get a say in improving the standard of parenting in society? No! Non-parents, or those whose children are already grown up, don’t get a say, nor do they get a say in people’s decision to have children (mind you, around 50% aren’t decisions at all, just stupidity). It’s a rather weird situation since we DO have to suffer the consequences when people do not carry out their parenting role properly.
In my experience it is childfree people that are fighting for parenting lessons to become mandatory, and that is most definitely to the BENEFIT of children!
Hating children is hating children. Wanting parents to be better at parenting is most definitely LOVING children!
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And what term would you use to describe not actually being a parent but thinking you know all about it?
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Oh, that one again
Well, having been a child with parents is a good start. Having grown up around other children with parents, having seen what they did well or poorly. Having spent lots and lots of time with friends and family that are parents again seeing what they did well or poorly. Some people naturally take in people observations, others don’t. Then there’s simple child psychology, and well, it is really a very simple subject.
Let’s face it, if parenting was anything akin to an intellectually tasking job there wouldn’t be billions of parents!
What makes parents with say 2 or 3 kids think THEY know about children? After all, they actually only know about their own 2 or 3 kids! Billions of different children out there with teachers, doctors, nurses, nursery staff, shopkeepers, restaurant owners, etc. i.e. people that come into contact with more children than just being a parent will cause you to
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Nearly forgot, add in having worked with people who may have been 30 and upwards but whose mental and emotional ages were that of children.
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Brave and honest letter Monica, I hope that’s not your real name, mothers have a huge amount of time on their hands to look for you. I see no one has answered your question, anyone remember what it was – why does having children give you special privelages” well because I want it to isn’t an answer.
To all the mums who absolutely must drive a tank and park it outside the supermarket doors – 30 years ago people had more kids and fewer people had cars, no one except farmers drove 4X4′s, how on earth did they manage.I recall walking with my brothers and all of us carried bags for mum, of course this wasn’t perfect, there was always the danger that we would burn a few calories, and the neighbours placed a lesser value on our shoes than they do your shiny 4X4.
Maybe a drive thru supermarket is the answer, then they wouldn’t even have to vacate their cars. The shops have pandered to your perceived need, why the rest of us have to I’ve no idea.
Choose to have kids then take the disadvantages as well as the advantages, and try using your feet for something other than engaging the clutch.
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So far Sarah at comment 16 has made the most sense and particularly the last paragraph! The writer of the letter obviously has a lot of time on her hands to allow herself to get so upset by such a petty issue.Jersey used to be a place where in general people were pleasant and considerate to others but it now seems to be peppered with miserable grumpy people who care only about themselves and are bitter about the most unimportant things.I really have more interesting and important things to think about than who may have a better parking place at the shop.Just a point for some here to think about however-babies and children have always neeeded prams,buggies etc yet special parking spaces are a fairly recent idea-makes me wonder how on earth I used to manage when I went shopping with my children many years ago but then perhaps in the good old days people used to offer assistance and be pleasant towards a struggling mum?
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# 16 ‘And as for the me me me me, surely this letter is far more indulgant of the me me me attitude, with a little foot stamping, arm crossing and ‘its not fair’ added in for good measure?’
Probably bad timing. You know what us women are like.
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As a parent, I agree with the author of this letter. There is absolutely no reason why we need spaces closer to the supermarket. And I’ve often wondered why some people think that is.
Again another example of portraying a mollycoddled society in which children are not being given the tools or opportunities to learn how to be safe in our environment.
I always park at the back of the car park as it is a good opportunity to practise walking safely where there is some traffic therefore educating my kids in good road sense. The evidence being that when my children have had friends stay over and we have had to go to the shops, whilst my children can walk safely from A to B, their friends have been all over the place!
Niamh, it is exactly some of the comments here that reinforce the stereotypes that you clearly get upset by. and I too am fed up with parents who think that just because they have children that they should take priority over everyone else.
For some of the other posters, not all parents are incapable of walking safely across the carpark with their children, and are more than happy to do so.
Keep the spaces near the door for the elderly or disabled.
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Those who say that children are the sole ‘problem’ of the parents and do not deserve some protection by the society that they live in are clearly in the ‘me me me’ brigade and a small step away from being dangerous. These folk are greedy and probably a risk to us all because if they have no compassion for the needs of children and mothers to be I wonder what else they have little care for?
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Unless a mother-to-be is actually ill she has no needs that any stranger needs to take into account. And if she is ill then she must expect the same assistance to be afforded to all other ill people (and it usually isn’t!)
Given the attitude of some of today’s mothers-to-be I really do wonder how the billions before them managed, especially since the billions before had none of the technology available today.
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Reading between the lines this is a gripe about all the benefits that parents get when having children. Having a child is a biological need for our species. However, having the choice now makes it a selfish act to do so and also not to have them. Those who choose ‘not to’ moan about the tax breaks and other concessions given out but fail to understand the HUGE expense of having a child which is only slightly mitigated by the tax breaks etc. Every working person who has a child takes a massive hit in their income but take that on board happily to have a family. And before you start there are only a small minority who, as always gets trotted out ‘produce kids for the benefits’. My point is if I did not have children I would be substantially better off even without the tax breaks etc. Monica if you have chosen not to have children enjoy your freedom and the extra wealth that comes with it and remember it will be the children of today contributing to the revenues that will keep all the public services running when you are well into retirement and have earned the right to no longer contribute.
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It sets a bad example to children for some people to expect special treatment and then to behave like spoilt ones when they don’t get it. It’s called the indulgence culture. Everyone has to tiptoe round these people in case they throw the toys out of the “pwam”.
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Agree about the 4×4′s no one used them back in the 1970′s and they all managed no problem at all. 4 x 4′s are very wide for conventional parking spots and add in the fact that some mums can’t park properly and you end up with many of these vehicles taking up two places. The same holds true down narrow lanes when smaller vehicles end up having to reverse a hundered metres or so because these mums are too scared to scrape their cars and expect the lesser mortals to take the risk instead.
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Parents unite – are you fed up with the consistent anti-children agenda that exists on this site – I am. Is this the real jersey? Because if it is you are going to make people with families leave or not want to come here. But maybe you all want that an island of pensioners and singletons not wanting to share life with children – gosh I thought chatty chatty bang bang was a movie but it looks like. It is real and jersey what are you becoming an island with no soul.
Btw wider parking spaces are useful no matter what size the car because you have to open the door out fully to allow little people who want to be independent get in by themselves otherwise you might lose fingers and scratch other people’s cars.
Also if mums work full time then there are no extra benefits and childcare even high quality is not necessarily tax deductible so there are no extra financial tax breaks of having children but there are amazing moments, great fun, love and just the best experience ever. Life is about having an amazing experience and balancing that with a solid income both of which can be achieved with the joy of having a child and without a tax payer handout no more than some of the anti-child complainers on this site. A good education is the right of any child and they should feel they are in a safe society.
Those of you who judge think twice if you want to make a difference volunteer if you want to be discriminatory and judgemental the don’t be surprised if the young people of today react negatively to negative judgements.
I dont think there will be that many people left to pay your pension and why should they when they are not welcome
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Well said !!
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As usual, there is a lot of twaddle from ignorant people on here ! Part of it is down to resentment, because there is simply not enough parking for everyone ! I personally don’t agree with disabled people having free parking on the basis that everyone else has to pay, such charges rising annually by the inlflated rate of inflation. (However, my elderly father has a badge so good luck to him !)
As for the size of mums cars, well this is down to legislation and vehicle design. The days when you could have three kidds rattling around unbelted in the back of a Mini are long gone – It’s seats and belts for all these days, and everyone knows that ! All cars are getting bigger, the current Ford Fiesta is massive compared with the original Mk I When I was a kid, families had large estate cars so nothing has really changed.
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29; Protection is one thing; grovelling is another.
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24
Eliza
‘just a reminder to the kids haters…..
… these little people will be looking after you when you are old, such as paying tax. etc. BE NICE’
Oh yeah? You think that most of them will be of any real use to man or beast?
As it is, their parents are already unhappy about supporting the older generation. Why would the even younger generation become more responsible?
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This lady raises an interesting point.
I am all for them having larger spaces in Public car parks, and if they feel the need for a large space then they should pay extra for taking up more room.
These spaces result in lost revenue to the tax payer, perhaps the States should think about bringing in a measure on parking spaces, the more room you take up, the more you pay. User pays seems to exclude certain section of society.
Those with 4 x 4′s can afford it!
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Decent people unite – are you fed up with the consistent spoilt-children agenda that exists on this site – I am. Is this the real jersey? Because if it is you are going to make people with indulgent families leave or not want to come here, which is just as well. But maybe you all want an island of decent and polite people who set a good example to children – gosh I thought chatty chatty wang wang was a movie but it looks like. It is real and jersey what are you becoming an island with backbone and moral fibre.
Btw wider parking spaces are useful no matter what size the car because you have to open the door out fully to allow little, undisciplined, people who want to be independent and unsupervised get in by themselves otherwise you might lose fingers and scratch other people’s cars and then try and blame someone else for the damage.
Also if mums work full time then there are no extra benefits and childcare even high quality is not necessarily tax deductible so there are no extra financial tax breaks of having children but there are amazing moments, great fun, love and just the best experience ever, so long as everyone else doesn’t have to pay for it! Life is about having an amazing experience and balancing that with a solid income both of which can be achieved with the joy of having a child and without a tax payer handout or other expected charity from people no more than some of the pro- spoilt child complainers on this site. A good education is the right of any child and they should feel they are in a safe society, not that parking at a supermarket has much to do with that.
Those of you who judge ordinary people without children think twice if you want to make a difference volunteer if you want to be discriminatory and judgemental the don’t be surprised if the young people of today react negatively to negative judgements. Indeed, we are teaching them to react by making them think that everyone else has to give way to them.
I dont think there will be that many people left to pay your pension and why should they when they are not welcome, even though you have paid your social security contributions and income tax and are entitled to a state pension as a matter of law.
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It would be a decent thing if people could park between the two lines properly and not scratch or scrape other peoples’ cars with their lack of care and don’t give a stuff about anyone else attitude.
Not much hope of that is there?
Society needs a major overhaul.
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I am FED UP with getting my doors dented by the selfish oafs parked next to me who fling their doors open wide without a care in the world what they hit and damage.
For that reason I park at the far end, away from others, right up against a wall or kerb, etc. Where this isn’t possible, I will happily park in the wider spaces for parents. If People-In-General don’t care about me and my car, then I pay that back my way. What goes around comes around. It can seems like a very selfish society out there, so it doesn’t inspire me to waste my time being nice to a world that treats me with contempt.
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Man say; man and woman with children who think world owe them are like fish swimming upstream. They heed not others. Offspring also swim upstream and have many problems when grow older. Man say no man and woman better than others and he who hide behind children to get favour is no friend to young one.
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What a ridiculously pathetic letter. If thats all youve got to worry about, then get over it. Its supermarket property so entirely up to them how they allocate their spaces. Its called making life easier for your customers – customer service. Disabled get allocated spaces, pensioners get various benefits, etc etc. Suppose youve got a problem with them too. People like you make me sick. Bitter and twisted with nothing better to do.
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39, I can well sympathise.
Many is the time that I have parked in a near empty car park and I have gone as far out of the way as possible in order to make sure that no idiot parks next to me and damages the car.
Invariably, I return to the car and find that some twit has parked right up against it, even where there are numerous other empty places. Why?!! Sometimes the idiot has parked so close that I have to shoehorn my way into the car. Is parking in a straight line so difficult that people have to park right next to someone else to get it right? Perhaps I should park at an angle and see if the copycat sheep muppets do that as well!
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Children give many advantages.
Increased benefits for the work shy.
Larger States home for the profligate.
Enormous States spending on education and their health.
I say cut off all the above benefits
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I applaud Monica for giving what she knew was going to be an unpopular opinion. I don’t necessarily agree with everything she said, but fair play to her for having an alternative view.
And to those people who have said something along the lines of “Hasn’t she got anything better to do with her time than send in this letter?” – haven’t you got anything better to do than comment about her letter? Especially with having children. Shouldn’t you be looking after them? And why ever comment about anything? Surely we’ve all got better things to do?
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It’s an excellent letter. It sets out what a great deal of people think. Those who don’t agree don’t agree but they should leave it at that instead of trying to suppress the writer’s freedom of speech.
Shouting down something with which you don’t agree sets a bad example to children. Such a thing seems to be very common these days and may explain to a large degree the fall in behavioural standards. In reality, the parent and child spaces also set a bad example, fostering as they do a “me” attitute and a sense of delusional entitlement which will get carried into adulthood. Although we live in an equal society, the agressive message to our children appears to be that some are more equal than others and woe betide anyone who dares to disagree.
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No 36 How about all the people supporting your children through taxes when they do not have any children of their own ???
As for me I park wherever I like, its says parent with children, so I was a parent with and still have adult children so therefore i can park there.
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We really must take our hats off to the real parents of yesteryear who used to have 5 – 12 kids, lived in a two up two down house, didn’t have a car, didn’t have a mobile phone stuck to their ear, didn’t depend on handouts from the social because dad worked hard all day to keep them all. Mum didn’t need to go to a supermarket because she stayed at home all day cooking, cleaning, bringing up well mannered children who were happy to play games in the street, not selfish little brats who want want for nothing
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When my children were young, there were no privelaged parking spaces but then again, there were no 4×4′s on the roads.
I had to crawl through the boot of my car to gain access a few days ago as I had been blocked in both sides by 4×4′s.
Wouldn’t the simplest solution be to widen the spaces available to accomodate all these 4×4′s and other modern car carriers???
Guess that will be a ‘no’ too. Heaven forbid the states would even consider reducing the income generated from all these ridiculously narrow spaces!
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It amazes me how on one hand some people say its lazy of parents with children to park in parent and child spaces outside the shop…
…yet on the other hand admit they park there themselves for whatever reason they use to make themselves feel better.
As for all these mythical benefits of joining the parenting club, obviously i haven’t signed up the right place because i don’t have a 4×4! nor do my husband and myself get away with not having a job..
Oh and im writing this comment at 9pm which is when my kids are in bed fast asleep where they should be.
Not everyone who has kids is on benefits. Should i suggest then that all those who don’t have kids have 3 holidays a year, drive brand new cars…..no? Surely that stereotype is true if the one about parents is?
Oh no wait. Its more hysterics from kid haters.
As for the elderly not causing problems, i have to avoid Grand Marche on a Tuesday or Wednesday otherwise i can’t shop with my sleeping little darling because of all the elderly who treat it like an OAP convention where they can have a conversation around the tinned aisle, and seem to be deaf to my polite ‘Excuse Me’ and then mutter when i ask even louder.
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46
‘No 36 How about all the people supporting your children through taxes when they do not have any children of their own ???’
Helena, I have no children that I know about.
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What an interesting debate! As a child from the 70s in my family of 6 it was my father who always did the shopping – without any of us! Maybe we were more enlightened then…
Fast forward to today: although we do not have the likes of Tesco/Opodo etc to deliver our weekly shop to our door in Jersey, we do have other providers like Mercury and Valley Foods who do the same. I wonder why, if shopping is so stressful and dangerous an activity for mothers with children that they would not consider these alternate options?
I fear that everyone everywhere is becoming far more selfish generally: people rarely thank you for letting them pull out/drive etc, no-one checks on their elderly neighbours or offers to do their shopping for them. Jersey is becoming like a large city: cramped, and as there is no space, everyone is out for themselves – parking space or otherwise. And because we as adults are not showing a caring and tolerant attitude towards others, our children do not learn to have respect for anyone!
What we need is more respect for all members of the community and not just certain parts of it.
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49; “lovely” comments at 49; the “me me me” is amplified by the failure to respect the old and infirm. Goodness knows what values your children will grow up with. The parking nonsense perhaps represents the tip of the iceburg when it comes to the breeding of louts.
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I agree with what most people have said here – on both sides of the debate!
Way back in the 70s, my father used to do the shopping for our family (of 6) on his own! And whilst Jersey does not have the likes of Tesco/Opodo for internet grocery shopping, we do have local suppliers Mercury and Valley Foods who have a similar offering. Surely these companies could provide a valuable service to those who have difficulty shopping such as the elderly, disabled and those with children??
Underlining all the arguments on this topic is the selfishness of today’s society: whether that be parents expecting special priviledges at local supermarkets, no-one saying thank you when you give them the right of way (in the car or on foot) or neglecting to help those less advantaged than themselves. Jersey does not help itself here: we live on a cramped little rock where housing and parking is at a premium, parking spaces are miniscule and as a result everyone becomes a lot less tolerant of one another. If, we do not look to becoming less selfish (whatever our needs), our (future) children will have no moral example and no respect for anyone or their property.
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So many posts, all of them missing the point.
The reason why supermarkets have parking spaces for parents with kids near to the entrances is simple: because they are the demographic that spends most money.
Go to a supermarket: rows of sweets, snacks, biscuits, yoghurts, nappies, cereals, a disproportionate amount of high-margin products aimed at children. Most people with children are between 30-50, time-poor and thus also in the demographic sweet-spot for discretionary spending on wine, organic, luxury and impluse purchases.
The reason why we have parking spaces next to the store is simple: because we are likely to spend more than the childless and the supermarkets want to do everything to attract us.
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Your post does highlight the laziness of today’s parents, laziness that supermarkets have obviously come to know. People always needed stores to buy from, and not having parking right outside didn’t stop them from buying their goods there. Supermarkets have wised up to the fact that today a short walk is too much to ask of some people. It’s very sad when marketing strategy starts to acknowledge people’s laziness.
Most people 30-50 are time-poor etc. It has nothing to do with having children
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As parent of a child – no longer small – i used the parent and child spaces where available but no longer do so as there is not all the car seats etc required. I drive a van and yes can park it in the middle of the lines. If you really want to get annoyed about parking spaces try living in St Aubin or Gorey. You then soon find out about dents/scratches etc and being unable to access your the doors to your vehicle.
Just a thought. The car is here to stay, get used to it.
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Children will grow up, they will work, pay tax, social security and run the essential services that the retired section of society need to survive.
For this to happen, women go through child birth, men and women have sleepless nights, pay exorbitant child care costs, shell out a fortune in university fees with no help from the States, all so the moaning brigade can have a pension in retirement and someone to hand feed them when their facualties go west!
I think people who have kids do deserve to be treated as a little bit special; without then society would eventually collapse.
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Society will collapse if everyone having kids think they are ‘special’ and this will rub off on the ‘special’ kids, really not a nice attitude to have.. these ‘special’ kids are just spoilt brats and I hate to think how they will turn out. Good luck with your attitude cos it sounds like you are gonna need it when your ‘special’ kids grow up into monsters.
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We have contributed plenty for our own pensions so are owed them! More of today’s children will be in socially pointless jobs, jail, on benefits (etc.) than in any kind of caring profession. Those that are in a caring profession will do it because they are PAID to do it (i.e. because they want to be able to live for their OWN sake), not out of the goodness of their hearts
Stop the pay and I’m quite sure they’ll (rightly) withdraw their services!
Childfree people also get to have sleepless nights, sometimes due to chronic ill health, other times because of complete strangers’ badly-parented children! We pay our own university fees, despite previously having paid those of others, some of us have to pay costs for people to nurse elderly parents, and some of us go through worse pain than childbirth simply due to conditions we were born with (not those we chose to have).
So no, you really don’t deserve to be treated as a little special. Well everyone deserves that, but not just for having sex and getting pregnant, it’s hardly unusual, indeed the majority of the billions of women that have existed since time began have done it! Not getting pregnant is actually more difficult. You are just a.n.other person, just like all of our species, and just like your child/children will be, no more, no less. That’s not a negative statement, each one of us special in our own way but none of us worthy of preferential treatment for choices we have made ourselves, equality should always take priority.
Also, it does make me laugh that anyone whose children were either a drunken mistake or the result of utter stupidity should ever be praised for the result of that mistake in any way! You may not be such a person, but if you think parents should be treated as special then you are including such idiots.
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Perhaps “parents with children” would like to jump the supermarket queue on the basis of some ludicrous excuse to do with child safety. I wouldn’t speak too soon; it could happen!
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I was a parent before these spaces existed. When we were in a parking lot or the grocery store my children held hands and walked. Three of them about 2 years apart and sometimes three more children their ages that I babysat. They had “jobs” when we entered the store. They knew how to stay close to me and to watch for others and how to behave. Before they were old enough to do this I carried them or placed them in a stroller.
Parents don’t need special places they need to teach children to behave properly. And no my children were not beaten. And pregnancy in most cases does not make you disabled I walked everywhere I needed to go when I lived in Germany with one in a carrier, one in a buggy and groceries or laundry while pregnant. ou pregnant lady are making excuses
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Parking lot of the grocery store!?! I hope your American\Canadian, otherwise its Carpark of the Supermarket!
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ah , you reminded me off my dear old mum, who would of said , “well you just have to get on with it son”.
i remember being fitted with reigns( cant run off with those on.)
and unlike yourself , my mother would restore order, with a thick ear .( didnt do me any harm)
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More than Capable – you have summed this up perfectly.
Chosing to have children is exactly that – a choice. It is not an affliction and does not entitle anyone to special treatment.
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Clanger 56 – Children will grow up, they will work, pay tax, social security and run the essential services that the retired section of society need to survive.
For this to happen, women go through child birth, men and women have sleepless nights, pay exorbitant child care costs, shell out a fortune in university fees with no help from the States, all so the moaning brigade can have a pension in retirement and someone to hand feed them when their facualties go west!
I think people who have kids do deserve to be treated as a little bit special; without then society would eventually collapse.
Clanger no one is saying there shouldn’t be children, of course we need them, just not as many as are currently spat out and not at taxpayers expense. have kids by all means but be financially responsible for them and don’t expect to be allocated privelaged status for you lifestyle choice.
Donald Pond – So many posts, all of them missing the point.
The reason why supermarkets have parking spaces for parents with kids near to the entrances is simple: because they are the demographic that spends most money.
Go to a supermarket: rows of sweets, snacks, biscuits, yoghurts, nappies, cereals, a disproportionate amount of high-margin products aimed at children. Most people with children are between 30-50, time-poor and thus also in the demographic sweet-spot for discretionary spending on wine, organic, luxury and impluse purchases.
The reason why we have parking spaces next to the store is simple: because we are likely to spend more than the childless and the supermarkets want to do everything to attract us.
I’m afraid you are missing the point, the question was “Why does having children give you special privileges”?
You only answer addressing one of the many privelages, tax breaks would be an obvious point to consider, why do those who take less out of the system pay more in to subsidise those who choose to have children.
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The reason parents get tax breaks in many societies is similar to the reason parking places for parents are closer to the supermarket.The supermarket wants our custom. Society wants us to have children, because children will be the workers, professionals and taxpayers of the future. If children were not seen as desirable by a government there would be no tax breaks or other “special privileges”. Look at China, where you can (or at least could until very recently) be punished for having more than one child, because China wanted to limit its population. In France, which wants to grow its population, women have financial incentives to have more than two children.
Its just social economics at the end of the day.
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I don’t have children, I am not old or infirm….does the fact that parents, the elderly and the infirm get to park closer to the store than me annoy? No, I have never given it a second thought. Parents can park closer under the guise of safety etc but we all know its because the supermarkets want attract them to their store as they spend a fair amount. Of course its better for parents, good on them I say. I think the disabled spaces are slightly more altruistic on the supermarkets part, but again I have no problem with them. Lets face facts, we do not have stores and car park big enough for us to moan about parking miles away!
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Being a parent may be more satisfying than being barren by choice or misfortune, but it is not easier. The usual ranking of best spots for the infirm, next best for those with little kids in tow and the rest of the car park for everyone else is fairly and sensibly needs based. And Donald’s point about looking after the best customers is another good reason from the car park owner’s viewpoint.
And as others have pointed out further up this thread, there are good reasons why family cars were always bigger than runabouts, and modern cars are bigger than old ones. If you really want to complain about cars taking more than their share of space, try picking on the executive saloons and grand tourers that take up far more road overall than their usable loadspace, just for the prestige of their long bonnets and bulging wheel arches.
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The term ‘barren’ is generally applied to those that cannot have children, but I’m guessing you’ve used it as an attempt to be offensive so you probably don’t care.
If being a parent was actually more satisfying then it would be obvious on the faces of parents and everyone WOULD want to be a parent. If it is satisfying then it’s safe to say that you parents hide that satisfaction very well! It clearly isn’t more satisfying, it’s just different. For those of us that were born not wanting children a life without them is definitely more satisfying than a life with them. You might have 2 children and be satifised, someone else will consider your life highly unfulfilling because you don’t have 5 children. Thankfully everyone is different and everyone enjoys different things.
Nor is being a parent any harder than not having children, again it is just different.
If you are genuinely satisfied then other people not wanting children shouldn’t bother you at all.
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Stupid letter.
I am a physically-strong guy with a child who is now 16 months, so she is now walking, but a mere few months ago I would have had to carry her and all of our shopping from the supermarket to the car. Not particularly easy for me, and certainly a lot more difficult for a mother to manage. That is one of the many reasons why these spaces are close to the supermarket.
Oh, I don’t drive a 4×4 by the way – another incorrect stereotype, written by a woman who perhaps is a tad bitter that she possesses neither a big car nor a child.
I would say, however, that these spaces are meant for parents with YOUNG children – surprising how many people seem to think they can still park there when the offspring is 10 years old and more than capable of walking across the car park. In this instance, at least, I would concur with the sentiment.
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Why on earth would you have needed to carry the child and the shopping to the car? Why not leave child in trolley seat, reload bagged shopping into trolley and wheel both child and shopping to car. Simples
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I have brought up 5 children who in turn are bringing up their children, all in all 15 children…….over the years we have all shopped in ALL of the supermarkets in Jersey and under the correct discipline and their respect for other peoples property, none of them have been injured or done any damage to anybodies cars etc……………There is no need for these stupid parking spaces allocated to Parents / Children….if the parents cannot control their children they should not of had them…………and Yes if my children or grandchildren are not with me I WILL park in the areas and what is the supermarket going to do…….ban me from shopping???????
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You may think you have brought up your children properly, but many others may think that:
a) being a self-styled “Moaning Old Bugger”;
b) telling people that you ignore rules when they do not serve your narrow self-interest; and
c) not knowing the difference between “of” and “had”
means that your children may not have had such an ideal upbringing.
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It’s not a ‘rule’ though is it? It’s not legally enforcable, and it wasn’t implemented by people that were democratically elected. It is just something that some people, completely unconnected to most of us I would imagine, decided to do.
If we were to obey all such ‘rules’ then there is nothing to stop other people bringing in even more ridiculous ‘rules’.
Given that badly behaved kids drive other shoppers out of supermarkets (losing sales in the process) maybe supermarkets should consider discouraging children altogether and encourage adults to leave their kids with their partner/friend and enjoy a stress-free shop?
Anyway, why should moaningoldbugger obey rules set by a supermarket while others get to totally disobey rules like speed limits that are set by actual authorities.
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Its got nothing to do with kids running out of control, its about a service provider making live a little bit easier for its important customers, maybe those without kids should try to do a weekly shop with a pram, and then comment!
and yes moaning oldbugger they should ban you if you abuse their rules. moaning selfishold bugger more like. and everyone says its those with kids with the me me me attitude.
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Q. Does having children give you special privileges?
A. No and especially not in Jersey
Q. Does a supermarket want to attract frequent shoppers who also purchase large amounts of food?
A. Yes
Q. What is one of the ways to attract mothers with small children to a supermarket?
A. Offer incentives such as priority parking otherwise they will choose to shop elsewhere where is more convenient.
Supermarkets are excellent at understanding customer needs and desires so they generate more money from their consumers. Parents don’t demand parking spaces, like we don’t ask for creches but supermarkets make it easier for us to shop there.
It is purchasing power pure and simple. Supermarkets are one place in jersey where they positively welcome families.
For all those harking back to the good ol days and remembering their childhood before priority parking remember it was before the age of the supermarket and sophisticated marketing and also I remember that other adults had time for children and even offered advice and would offer help to mothers with children. Judge others as you yourself are prepared to be judged.
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Others offered such because the parents weren’t utter nightmares who thought the world owed them a living. They understood that their children were their responsibility and they didn’t believe society should be subjected to their child’s bad behaviour for any longer than absolutely necessary. If a child played up in public the parent would take them home straight away, even if it mucked up their own plans. Also the children were generally more polite and understood different social circumstances and what behaviour and noise level was appropriate for each, probably because their parents had taught them that.
Anyway, you’re not allowed to offer advice these days, as you can see from posts above, apparently you have to be a parent to understand children
Some parents talk like children are an alien species or something, rather than just less developed versions of human adults. Children are just adults without the education and discipline to counter their animal instincts.
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